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Author Topic: Zero Tolerance = Zero common sense - It's time to homeschool Back to Topics
HotRod10

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Wyoming

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Message Posted: Apr 8, 2014 10:36:19 AM

The government schools have gone crazy. If it's not a kid getting strip-searched and "evaluated" for 5 hours for twirling a pencil, it's 2nd grade math problems an engineer can't figure out.

At least once a week, I see something that makes me say "Thank God my kids are homeschooled".

Have you considered homeschooling? If so, why haven't done it?

Won't even consider it? Why not?
REPLIES (newest first) Post a Reply
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HotRod10
Champion Author Wyoming

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Message Posted: Oct 20, 2014 9:23:46 AM

"Tell that to the thousands attacked throughout the world every day..."

Talk about non-sequitur...
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Weaslespit
Champion Author Cincinnati

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Message Posted: Oct 20, 2014 12:54:07 AM

"Tell that to the women in that shelter in Toronto."

Tell that to the thousands attacked throughout the world every day...

"So, because people violate the law, the law should change. That's a great idea. Besides, I'd like to see your evidence. I haven't seen anyone caught around here."

One has nothing to do with the other - that is called a non sequitur.
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HotRod10
Champion Author Wyoming

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Message Posted: Oct 19, 2014 9:45:47 PM

"It doesn't make it any less safe."

Tell that to the women in that shelter in Toronto.

"You don't have to, they do it already anyway..."

So, because people violate the law, the law should change. That's a great idea. Besides, I'd like to see your evidence. I haven't seen anyone caught around here.

[Edited by: HotRod10 at 10/19/2014 9:50:40 PM EST]
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Weaslespit
Champion Author Cincinnati

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Message Posted: Oct 19, 2014 12:10:32 PM

"I was saying we don't allow, by law, biological males to use women's facilities around here."

You don't have to, they do it already anyway...

"unless you are trying to suggest that allowing sexual predators access to women's facilities would somehow make it safer for the women."

It doesn't make it any less safe. Tough to grasp, I know.
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HotRod10
Champion Author Wyoming

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Message Posted: Oct 18, 2014 11:53:05 PM

"So with the 'known' predators taking advantage of women in the women's restroom, we aren't doing anything to protect them already?"

You need to work on your reading comprehension. I was saying we don't allow, by law, biological males to use women's facilities around here. So, you have it completely backwards, unless you are trying to suggest that allowing sexual predators access to women's facilities would somehow make it safer for the women.

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Weaslespit
Champion Author Cincinnati

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Message Posted: Oct 17, 2014 4:42:07 PM

"I had to wonder if she tried to make something of it who would be in the wrong?"

Apparently you were lucky you weren't taken advantage of...
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streetrider
Champion Author Gary

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Message Posted: Oct 17, 2014 4:34:25 PM

This reminds me of the time I got surprised by a woman in a mans bathroom.
I had to wizz really bad, walked from front to rear of this large store, stepped in side of the men's room and there was a woman in front of the first stall facing the urinals. She was waiting on her kid while the hubby was near the bathroom but slightly down the aisle outside of the bathroom. I didn't think there were urinals in the women's bathroom but I stepped out side to check the signage. Yep I was in the right place, by now I am ready to pee my pants. I step back in and start peeing; she is standing there watching me. trying to think do I give it a couple extra shakes to insult her or what? As I finished peeing I turned towards her as she was still watching I decided to call her a pervert. She quickly turned around and said sorry. I think she was trying to piss her hubby off for not taking the boy to the bathroom. Sure the women's bathroom was empty, the store was almost empty. I had to wonder if she tried to make something of it who would be in the wrong?

[Edited by: streetrider at 10/17/2014 4:36:46 PM EST]
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Weaslespit
Champion Author Cincinnati

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Message Posted: Oct 17, 2014 4:28:04 PM

"We don't."

So with the 'known' predators taking advantage of women in the women's restroom, we aren't doing anything to protect them already?

Interesting that you are OK with your Wife and your Daughter being placed in harm's way...

"That's news to me."

I would venture to guess that in Wyoming there aren't many large venues with long lines at the women's facility and short-to-no-lines for the men's facilities (sports, concerts, etc)...

It is a pretty regular occurrence - more regular than a predatory attack, anyway.
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sgm4law
Champion Author Maryland

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Message Posted: Oct 17, 2014 4:14:09 PM

<That's news to me. I haven't heard of that happening around here, maybe where you live, but not here. Anyway, women using men's facilities wouldn't carry the same risks.>

It happens where there is a line at the women's for a single stall bathroom and no one in the men's. Makes no difference that the label on the door says "men" if there is only room for one person.
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HotRod10
Champion Author Wyoming

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Message Posted: Oct 17, 2014 4:10:46 PM

"How do you do it now?"

We don't. Biological males are currently not allowed in women's facilities. The incident I linked to happened in Canada, where what you suggest has already been implemented.

"Shoot, women use the men's restroom now as it is!"

That's news to me. I haven't heard of that happening around here, maybe where you live, but not here. Anyway, women using men's facilities wouldn't carry the same risks.
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Weaslespit
Champion Author Cincinnati

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Message Posted: Oct 17, 2014 2:46:21 PM

"And again, how do you make the distinction? If you open up women's facilities to transgendered people, how do keep out the men who dress as women to access those facilities and prey on the women?"

How do you do it now?

Shoot, women use the men's restroom now as it is!
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HotRod10
Champion Author Wyoming

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Message Posted: Oct 17, 2014 2:20:45 PM

"And again, one need not be transgendered to dress as a woman."

And again, how do you make the distinction? If you open up women's facilities to transgendered people, how do keep out the men who dress as women to access those facilities and prey on the women?
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Weaslespit
Champion Author Cincinnati

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Message Posted: Oct 17, 2014 1:18:22 PM

"Yes, dressing as a woman makes it easier for a sexual predator to access areas where women are vulnerable, as was the case with the shelter incident that I linked to."

And again, one need not be transgendered to dress as a woman. Keep making my point.
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AFSNCO
Champion Author Montgomery

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Message Posted: Oct 17, 2014 11:00:48 AM

It wasn't smug at all. I told you below that is the reason I posted the link and yet you still picked apart the link I posted. It was stats collected by and gathered by the community that is claiming they are persecuted. Why not ask the KKK how they feel about blacks?
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sgm4law
Champion Author Maryland

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Message Posted: Oct 17, 2014 10:53:40 AM

"You missed the point completely as to why I even posted it."

So smug, as always. I didn't miss your point. You read the posts I made with an eye to the self-reported data, and ignored objective statistics included in the same reports. Wow.
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BuzzLOL
Champion Author Toledo

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Message Posted: Oct 17, 2014 10:26:21 AM

.
< "the 'gay' community saying they are persecuted too..." >

. Nobody can tell somebody has succumbed to HOMOSEXUALITY ADDICTION unless they say or do something to make it obvious... or sue because they didn't get Special Homosexuality Addition Special Rights...
.
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HotRod10
Champion Author Wyoming

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Message Posted: Oct 17, 2014 10:25:08 AM

"Easier? You don't even have to declare to be transgendered to do the things you are now alluding to."

Yes, dressing as a woman makes it easier for a sexual predator to access areas where women are vulnerable, as was the case with the shelter incident that I linked to.
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AFSNCO
Champion Author Montgomery

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Message Posted: Oct 17, 2014 10:09:27 AM

"AFSNCO's study, which actually says that whites "believe they experience more racism than African Americans" despite the population wide statistics that show their suffering seems little correlated with economic outcomes. Did you even bother to read that article?"

Exactly...and you posted a link to a study done by the gay community saying they are persecuted too...so what is the difference? You missed the point completely as to why I even posted it. (Which BTW was below...did you even bother to read my post?) Which proves my point...if you ask the target group specific questions to get specific answers guess what? You will get the answers you want to prove what your study was set out to prove!
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Weaslespit
Champion Author Cincinnati

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Message Posted: Oct 17, 2014 9:57:37 AM

"So, if they're going to do it anyway, we should make it easier for them?"

Easier? You don't even have to declare to be transgendered to do the things you are now alluding to.

Good grief.
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sgm4law
Champion Author Maryland

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Message Posted: Oct 16, 2014 5:16:26 PM

Just read the whole thing.
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sgm4law
Champion Author Maryland

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Message Posted: Oct 16, 2014 5:11:19 PM

AFSNCO's study, which actually says that whites "believe they experience more racism than African Americans" despite the population wide statistics that show their suffering seems little correlated with economic outcomes. Did you even bother to read that article?

a quote: <<There’s a saying that “the new racism is to deny that racism exists.” If that is the case, it may explain a study conducted by researchers from Tufts University’s School of Arts and Sciences and Harvard Business School. Their findings claim that self-described white Americans believe they have “replaced blacks” as the primary victims of racial discrimination in contemporary America.>>

[Edited by: sgm4law at 10/16/2014 5:14:09 PM EST]
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HotRod10
Champion Author Wyoming

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Message Posted: Oct 16, 2014 4:32:28 PM

"Bingo. So why try blame the starting of a fire on something when it was there already?

Sexual predators are already out and doing what they do, regardless of the laws..."

So, if they're going to do it anyway, we should make it easier for them? Well, that makes a lot of sense. While we're at it, let's just do away with restraining orders and allow domestic abusers to freely walk into the homes of their victims.
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HotRod10
Champion Author Wyoming

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Message Posted: Oct 16, 2014 4:15:58 PM

That's a very interesting report sgm4law. As with any online survey, verifying that each response represents a unique individual is problematic at best. It also doesn't answer my question of how the rate for assaults compares with women in the general population, or for an accurate comparison, with non-transgender people in the same circumstances. A larger percentage of transgender people are homeless or working in the sex trade than in the general population, and both demographics experience assault at a much higher rate than the general population.

I also found some of the results intriguing. 13% of respondents answered "Primary Gender Identity Today" with "gender not listed here", when the other options were "Male/Man", "Female/Woman", and "Part time as one gender, part time as another, please specify".

The objectivity of the authors is also somewhat suspect:

"Dr. Jaime M. Grant is the founding Executive Director of the Arcus Center for Social Justice Leadership (ACSJL)...she served as director of the Policy Institute at the National Gay and Lesbian Task Force..."

"Lisa Mottet, Esq.is the Director of the Transgender Civil Rights Project at the National Gay and Lesbian Task Force..."

"Dr. Justin E. Tanis is on the staff of the National Center for Transgender Equality (NCTE) and has worked in LGBT organizations for close to 25 years as a community organizer, leader, educator and program specialist."

"Jack Harrison is a Vaid Fellow at the National Gay and Lesbian Task Force Policy Institute"

"Dr. Jody L. Herman is a consulting researcher for the National Gay and Lesbian Task Force"

"Mara Keisling is the founding Executive Director of the National Center for Transgender Equality."

So much for unbiased research.

[Edited by: HotRod10 at 10/16/2014 4:17:04 PM EST]
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Weaslespit
Champion Author Cincinnati

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Message Posted: Oct 16, 2014 4:05:44 PM

"But the point is if you ask the target group you are studying what they think the answers will be biased."

Certainly there is some truth to that which shifts the numbers...
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AFSNCO
Champion Author Montgomery

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Message Posted: Oct 16, 2014 4:00:35 PM

Try this link again.

Although it still does not really say what I want to get across. sgm linked to a study conducted by a gay and lesbian group where they asked gays and lesbians if they thought people were discriminatory toward them. Why not ask the KKK if they think that blacks are worthy individuals? Or ask a Muslim if they think Jews are the scum of the earth?

Don't you think that your study just has a little bias? (Ok, a lot of bias.)

But the point is if you ask the target group you are studying what they think the answers will be biased.
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Weaslespit
Champion Author Cincinnati

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Message Posted: Oct 16, 2014 3:53:30 PM

"Study finds whites face more racism than blacks."

I'm definitely aware of reverse racism but would not have thought the statement above to be the case. If possible, as sgm asked, please fix the link.
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Weaslespit
Champion Author Cincinnati

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Message Posted: Oct 16, 2014 3:52:01 PM

"Men and women are assaulted every day for reasons having nothing to do with their gender identity."

Bingo. So why try blame the starting of a fire on something when it was there already?

Sexual predators are already out and doing what they do, regardless of the laws...
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sgm4law
Champion Author Maryland

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Message Posted: Oct 16, 2014 3:51:37 PM

Please fix that link. I'd be interested to see that.
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AFSNCO
Champion Author Montgomery

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Message Posted: Oct 16, 2014 2:57:50 PM

Study finds whites face more racism than blacks.
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sgm4law
Champion Author Maryland

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Message Posted: Oct 16, 2014 2:53:31 PM

Report of the National Transgender Discrimination Survey.
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sgm4law
Champion Author Maryland

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Message Posted: Oct 16, 2014 2:45:31 PM

I almost can't believe you are unaware of the violence encountered by trans women.

GLAAD report; the group most disproportionately affected is trans women of color.

The FBI's crime reporting statistics just included a code for transgender victims as of 2013.
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HotRod10
Champion Author Wyoming

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Message Posted: Oct 16, 2014 2:30:57 PM

"Can you post the links where a straight male declared himself as transgendered to assault females?"

Sexual predator jailed after claiming to be ‘transgender’ in order to assault women in shelter

"You might find the opposite to be the case, actually (transgendered person assaulted)."

Yeah, there were a number of those stories as well, but none I saw occurred in restrooms or locker rooms, so how would access to those facilities help? Also unclear in some cases is whether the victims were targeted because they were transgendered, or if the perpetrators even knew. Men and women are assaulted every day for reasons having nothing to do with their gender identity. Do you have stats that show transgendered people are assaulted more often than, say, women is general?

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Weaslespit
Champion Author Cincinnati

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Message Posted: Oct 16, 2014 11:21:57 AM

"If you think that's hyperbole, you've obviously been insulated from reality."

If you say so... Can you post the links where a straight male declared himself as transgendered to assault females?

You might find the opposite to be the case, actually (transgendered person assaulted). I hope I didn't remove too much insulation with that revelation...
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HotRod10
Champion Author Wyoming

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Message Posted: Oct 16, 2014 9:57:53 AM

"Wow, the hyperbole is gettin' pretty thick."

If you think that's hyperbole, you've obviously been insulated from reality.
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Weaslespit
Champion Author Cincinnati

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Message Posted: Oct 15, 2014 4:23:50 PM

"So...for someone shameless, who's not interested in getting a date, there's nothing stopping them."

Wow, I guess you got me there with that clearly reasonable 'what-if' scenario.

"You just don't get it, do you?"

Correct - I do not get bigotry...

"I'm talking about guys who are perverse and desperate enough to dress as a woman in order to ogle, sexually assault, or rape women."

Wow, the hyperbole is gettin' pretty thick. The date rape drug is much easier and far more effective to that end...
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teacher_tim
Champion Author Maryland

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Message Posted: Oct 15, 2014 2:19:01 PM

Thanks for the info, Davewalk
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HotRod10
Champion Author Wyoming

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Message Posted: Oct 15, 2014 2:14:02 PM

"The public ostracization? Pretty hard to get a date too, so if your motives are unsavory you'd be shooting yourself in the foot with that tactic..."

So...for someone shameless, who's not interested in getting a date, there's nothing stopping them.

You just don't get it, do you? I'm not talking about people who want a date, I'm talking about guys who are perverse and desperate enough to dress as a woman in order to ogle, sexually assault, or rape women.

[Edited by: HotRod10 at 10/15/2014 2:17:41 PM EST]
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Davewalk
Champion Author Los Angeles

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Message Posted: Oct 15, 2014 12:15:26 PM

<<The IOC has always had a pretty clear definition of male and female.>>

Actually, currently that is not true at all. Take the case of South African track athlete Caster Semenya, who won the silver medal in the women's 800 meter race in the 2012 London Olympics amid controversy as to her gender. Semenya has both male and female characteristics, and actually has a Y chromosome but is missing a certain gene on that chromosome such that she developed as a female.

The IAAF and the IOC have actually moved away from genetic testing and toward measurement of testosterone levels.
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Weaslespit
Champion Author Cincinnati

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Message Posted: Oct 15, 2014 12:11:55 PM

"Again, why can't it be a choice made with ulterior motives? What would stop someone?"

The public ostracization? Pretty hard to get a date too, so if your motives are unsavory you'd be shooting yourself in the foot with that tactic...

Just more fear mongering of things we don't understand - a natural human instinct that I don't fault you for. It is inherent in all humans - and not a choice. ;)
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HotRod10
Champion Author Wyoming

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Message Posted: Oct 15, 2014 12:02:23 PM

"This isn't Halloween where you just 'say' what you are..."

It can be, unless you're suggesting some objective criteria.

"It isn't a 'choice' made out of convenience or with ulterior motives"

Again, why can't it be a choice made with ulterior motives? What would stop someone? There are shameless and perverse people out there, who would do much worse than "peep" if given the opportunity.

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teacher_tim
Champion Author Maryland

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Message Posted: Oct 15, 2014 11:51:12 AM

The IOC has always had a pretty clear definition of male and female.

Do they have a Y-chromosome?
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Weaslespit
Champion Author Cincinnati

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Message Posted: Oct 15, 2014 11:48:16 AM

"Weaslespit, if the only standard to define gender is whatever the individual says they are, then there is no standard."

This isn't Halloween where you just 'say' what you are - it IS what they are! Big difference - and unfortunately a distinction you are not seeing (or at least unwilling to see).

It isn't a 'choice' made out of convenience or with ulterior motives (peeping tom)...
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HotRod10
Champion Author Wyoming

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Message Posted: Oct 15, 2014 9:30:31 AM

Weaslespit, if the only standard to define gender is whatever the individual says they are, then there is no standard, there is only the word of the individual. You keep saying there is more to it, but you have repeatedly refused to state what other criteria there is; therefore, I must assume there isn't actually any, and you just don't want to admit it.
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Weaslespit
Champion Author Cincinnati

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Message Posted: Oct 14, 2014 11:09:20 AM

"I'm getting dizzy watching the circular reasoning."

You're getting dizzy as you are trying to constantly redefine words to spin comments made...

Talk about circular reasoning.
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Weaslespit
Champion Author Cincinnati

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Message Posted: Oct 14, 2014 11:08:11 AM

"Hotrod, now own words betray him:

"but who identifies themselves as a girl"

In contrast to how others identify them (and theirs is not by 'choice'). But please, tie any definition you need to try to make a point ;)
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HotRod10
Champion Author Wyoming

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Message Posted: Oct 14, 2014 12:02:28 AM

"The lack of reasoning is from those who make such silly claims as 'someone can just decide to identify themselves as whichever gender they choose to'"

So these people identified their gender themselves, but they didn't "decide to identify themselves as whichever gender they choose"? Exactly how does that work? Did their other personality choose for them?

[Edited by: HotRod10 at 10/14/2014 12:03:47 AM EST]
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Zimcity
Champion Author Twin Cities

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Message Posted: Oct 13, 2014 6:40:18 PM

Not the same thing.

The lack of reasoning is from those who make such silly claims as "someone can just decide to identify themselves as whichever gender they choose to"
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HotRod10
Champion Author Wyoming

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Message Posted: Oct 13, 2014 6:37:49 PM

Yes, Weaslespit and Zimcity both dismiss the idea that someone can just decide to identify themselves as whichever gender they choose to, after going on and on about gender being self-identified. I'm getting dizzy watching the circular reasoning.
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AFSNCO
Champion Author Montgomery

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Message Posted: Oct 13, 2014 5:59:21 PM

Hotrod, now own words betray him:

"but who identifies themselves as a girl"

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HotRod10
Champion Author Wyoming

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Message Posted: Oct 13, 2014 5:26:31 PM

"naturally variability in genetics."

Outside of some vary rare cases, the genetics match the biological outcome. In other words, males have the genetic makeup of a male, and females have the genetic makeup of a female. There are maybe a handful of cases where this is not true, but those cases have biological facts to prove it. The rest of those out there claiming to be a gender different than their biological gender have no evidence, only their word. That's just not good enough to convince me to allow a biological male in the locker room with my daughter.

In the vast majority of cases, I agree with AFSNCO, it's all psychological.

[Edited by: HotRod10 at 10/13/2014 5:28:58 PM EST]
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