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Author Topic: Will the new GOP darling, Cruz run for President in 2016? Back to Topics
Cliffisher

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Message Posted: Jul 22, 2013 1:05:29 PM

Of course there's also a small debate over whether or not Cruz, who was born in Calgary, Alberta, is eligible to run for President. He tried to blow that debate off. "My mother was born in Wilmington, Delaware. She’s a U.S. citizen, so I’m a U.S. citizen," he said at first, but that wasn't enough: "I’m not going to engage in a legal debate. The facts are clear," he added. "I can tell you where I was born and who my parents were. And then as a legal matter, others can worry about that. I’m not going to engage." Sorry, Ted: your presidential dreams may be dashed by the law.
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Cliffisher
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Message Posted: Jun 12, 2014 8:52:39 AM

Not to mention Cruz is still hiding his college transcripts
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Hemond
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Message Posted: Jun 11, 2014 8:02:50 PM

QuOTE ::::After a l o n g drawn out timetable, the Cuban born in Canada, Rafael Edward Cruz has officially renounced his Canadian citizenship.:::::


This is standard practice among politicians. Look how long it took Obama to release his birth certificate. Not to mention the president is still hiding his college transcripts.

Look how long its taking Hillary to come clean on Benghazi.

If anything the all American senator Cruz from Texas is showing remarkable speed.

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Cliffisher
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Message Posted: Jun 11, 2014 6:10:55 PM

After a l o n g drawn out timetable, the Cuban born in Canada, Rafael Edward Cruz has officially renounced his Canadian citizenship.

Our loss and Canada's gain?
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Hemond
Champion Author Providence

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Message Posted: May 10, 2014 6:51:22 AM

QUOTE :::When you state Cruz's dual citizenship is of no consequence, you state you really don't believe that clause is relevant in this case:::

Correct, I do not.

I believe Cruz is an American both legally and by mindset. This has also been verified by fellow poster Cliffisher.

I am convinced he holds allegiance to the US. Not to Canada nor to Cuba. Since Cliff has verified he is a US citizen, Cruz legally satisfies the requirements of the Constitution for a presidential bid. Any side arguments are indeed irrelevant.

By his speech and more importantly by his actions, he shows he's loyal to the US, not Canada or Cuba. Unless I'm a terrible judge of character, a Cruz administration would work in the best interests of the US, not of Canada or Cuba.

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rumbleseat
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Message Posted: May 10, 2014 4:02:49 AM

The purpose of the natural born citizen clause is to protect the nation from foreign influence. When you state Cruz's dual citizenship is of no consequence, you state you really don't believe that clause is relevant in this case, but, seriously, it is relevant in all cases, and since there is ABSOLUTE proof in the form of a birth certificate, it is far more relevant than it was in the Barack Obama protests, where NO foreign birth certificate has ever been produced that wasn't immediately acknowledged as fake.

St. George Tucker, an early federal judge, wrote in 1803 that the natural born citizen clause is "a happy means of security against foreign influence", and that "The admission of foreigners into our councils, consequently, cannot be too much guarded against."

Let me tell you who ALSO can't have dual citizenship. Absolute loyalty to ONLY the US is required, and the background check is called Yankee White.

Category one clearance is required for selected personnel serving in extremely sensitive positions in direct support of the President or Vice President. This includes:
- Chief of Staff, White House Military Office (WHMO)
- Assistant Chief of Staff, WHMO
- Military Aides to the President and Vice President
- Director, White House Medical Unit
- Chief, US Army Transportation Agency, White House
- Director, Special Programs Office, WHMO
- Security Advisor, WHMO
- Food Service Coordinator of the White House Staff Mess
- Commander and Deputy Commander, White House Communications Agency
- Presidential Pilot and Deputy Presidential Pilot, 89th Airlift Wing, Andrews AFB
- Commanding Officer and Executive Officer, Marine Helicopter Squadron One (HMX-1)
- Commanding Officer and Executive Officer, Naval Support Facility Thurmont, MD (Camp David)
- Director, Presidential Contingency Programs Office, WHMO
- Director, Airlift Operations Office, WHMO
- Other personnel as determined by the Director, WHMO and the Deputy Assistant to the Vice President for National Security Affairs

Source: Selection of DoD Military and Civilian Personnel and Contractor Employees for Assignment to Presidential Support Activities (PSAs), Department of Defense Instruction No. 5210.87 (November 30, 1998).

There are also Category 2, and Category 3 clearance levels.
Obtaining such clearance levels requires, in part, a Single Scope Background Investigation (SSBI) which is conducted under the manuals of the U.S. Office of Personnel Management.

"However, dual nationals owe allegiance to both the United States and the foreign country. They are required to obey the laws of both countries. Either country has the right to enforce its laws, particularly if the person later travels there. Most U.S. citizens, including dual nationals, must use a U.S. passport to enter the United States. Dual nationals may also be required by the foreign country to use its passport to enter that country."
Source: United States Embassy in Ottawa, citizen services.
Embassy of the United States

But you say none of it is of any consequence?


[Edited by: rumbleseat at 5/10/2014 4:10:06 AM EST]
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Hemond
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Message Posted: May 9, 2014 12:49:46 PM

QUOTE Cliffisher :::I could care less if he wants to run for president.:::

That was clear from your post body. You went cuckoo over his place of birth. Fixated on it in a way I've never seen a rational person do before. It took my arm twisting to force you to admit the truth. You clearly weren't developing the idea of him running for president. Just his birthplace.



QUOTE Cliffisher ::::The headline did what it was intended to do.:::

Yes it did. I use the exact same liberal technique on these boards when trying to get the attention of rabid left wing loons. The only difference is my topic titles are then developed in the post body. In the case of lunatic fringe liberals, they post some insane, off-the-wall topic title. Often with little bearing to the post body. As you just admitted you did.



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Cliffisher
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Message Posted: May 9, 2014 9:43:19 AM

I could care less if he wants to run for president.
He has about the same chance as a snowball in a furnace.

The headline did what it was intended to do.
A few low wattage GOPers birther types fell for it and I've been laughing ever since.
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Hemond
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Message Posted: May 9, 2014 9:39:36 AM

QUOTE Cliffisher ::::"Topic: Will the new GOP darling, Cruz run for President in 2016?"
What part of the header did you miss?:::

I'd be happy to respond.

One of the lessor of the useless college degrees that low achievement liberals obtain in their 'liberal arts' indoctrination is journalism. Notice I don't lump journalism in with gender studies, art history, psychology or some such. At one time journalism was populated by some pretty sharp people. Unfortunately, that period ended with the ascension of MSNBC, CNN, and such birdcage liners as the NY and LA Times.

The first thing they teach in Journalism 101 is "YOu gotta have a hook". Meaning you have to have an attention grabbing headline.

This is what you did Cliff with your post. You had an attention grabbing topic header. But then you went on to build a case that Cruz was a citizen of every other country on earth other than the US. You never did build a case as to whether he would run, but whether he is a US citizen.


[Edited by: Hemond at 5/9/2014 9:41:21 AM EST]
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Hemond
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Message Posted: May 9, 2014 9:26:33 AM

QUOTE Rumble :::The posts about Dershowitz and Obama are NOT about Cruz, yet you saw fit to participate. Based on your concern for the point of the OP's thread, I am not sure why, I imagine you will enlighten us.:::


Why certainly, I'd be happy to enlighten you.

An aside or tangential point can be of interest in themselves. What you attempted to do is make the tangent the centerpoint of the thread. In internet parlance , that's called 'hijacking'.

As for the Dershowitz angle, yes, its utterly irrelevant to the OP's central point. Fellow poster Buzzoil tossed it out for comment. He didn't try to hijack the thread with it. I jumped in because I agreed, I found it an interesting side tangent.

Obama clearly was not up to Ivy League standards. He still isn't. He clearly only got into Harvard through external influence, not by his credentials. Dershowitz saw this instantly. He didn't want a substandard doofus cluttering up his class. He wanted only the best. Of which Obama is not.
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Cliffisher
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Message Posted: May 9, 2014 9:25:42 AM

"Topic: Will the new GOP darling, Cruz run for President in 2016?"

What part of the header did you miss?

I thought all of you GOPer birther types would be all over it.

SHOW THE BIRTH CIRTIFICATE!!! was the GOPers tag line for four years.

Do the GOPers only have one sided outrage?

The next was OBamaCare (ACA). Now that it is up and running the GOPers can fall on their swords or come up with new outrage.


Come on Fox. Give them a hand.
ROTFLMAO
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Hemond
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Message Posted: May 9, 2014 9:12:46 AM

QUOTE Rumble :::It is about Cruz, and the Presidency, the original post is about Cruz, and the Presidency. Not sure what you are seeing that is different.::::


No it is not.
It is about whether Cruz is an American ciizen, and therefore eligible to run for the Presidency. Cliffisher had difficuly with that point at first, but he now clearly states Cruz is a US citizen. Any Canadian or Cuban connection is a cute side angle.


QUOTE Rumble :::The original post questioned whether Cruz will run for President.:::

No, it did not.
You didn't read the original post. The OP was concerned with Cruz's US citizenship. Cliff has now clearly stated Cruz is a US citizen.


QUOTE Rumble .....he can't serve as President unless he has renounced his Canadian citizenship. He will have to have that certificate, because a President can't have loyalties to two countries.::::

This has nothing to do with the original post.
This is an irrelevant side issue. Cliffisher was concerned as to whether Cruz was an American citizen and met the minimum birth standard under the Constitution to become President.

QUOTE Rumble A dual citizen not only could have loyalties to 2 different countries, but is subject to the laws of both countries.

Another irrelevant side issue.
Hmmm, I'm eligible for dual Italian / American citizenship. Eventually, I will file the paperwork to obtain Italian citizenship. I will never change my loyalties though. I remain American despite this other Italian aspect tied on. The reason I don't do it now is I'm of military age and will have to serve in the Italian army. Yuck.
Your premise is forced at best. The dual nationality thing doesn't change one's sense of place. Even if I emigrated to Italy with full citizenship,(might happen) I'd still remain American.

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rumbleseat
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Message Posted: May 9, 2014 8:22:27 AM

"That's very nice but not the point of the OP's thread."

It is about Cruz, and the Presidency, the original post is about Cruz, and the Presidency. Not sure what you are seeing that is different.

The posts about Dershowitz and Obama are NOT about Cruz, yet you saw fit to participate. Based on your concern for the point of the OP's thread, I am not sure why, I imagine you will enlighten us.

The original post questioned whether Cruz will run for President.
It is fact he can't serve as President unless he has renounced his Canadian citizenship. He will have to have that certificate, because a President can't have loyalties to two countries.

"The Canadian aspect is cute but utterly irrelevant."
Maybe in your mind.
Note, we do not claim that, by virtue of Canadian citizenship, Cruz is NOT a US citizen.
A dual citizen not only could have loyalties to 2 different countries, but is subject to the laws of both countries. Obviously a person who is subject to the laws of a country other than the US, and could have conflicting loyalties, can't be allowed to be Commander-in-Chief of the US armed forces. Can you say super fith column?
Dual citizenship negates the term "natural born citizen".
Feel free to consult a Congressional lawyer for an opinion.
It is assumed a granted renunciation would allow him to reclaim that status, as he would no longer be a Canadian citizen, and no longer subject to Canadian laws.
In other words, once he is confirmed to be no longer a Canadian citizen, there will no longer be a conflict of interest, actual, or perceived.

[Edited by: rumbleseat at 5/9/2014 8:23:08 AM EST]
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Hemond
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Message Posted: May 8, 2014 7:47:24 PM

QUOTE:::: but he CAN'T serve in that office without that certificate of renunciation of Canadian citizenship.:::


That's very nice but not the point of the OP's thread.

Cliffisher was dancing around as to whether Cruz was an American or not. If he was not American than there is no way he could run.

Took a bit of arm twisting by me and squirming on CF's part, but I finally got him to admit what he knew all along. Thus the premise of this thread has been satisfied. Cruz is an American citizen. You got that directly from Cliffisher in a post below.

The Canadian aspect is cute but utterly irrelevant.

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rumbleseat
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Message Posted: May 8, 2014 7:02:55 PM

Cruz can declare all he wants his desire to be President, but he CAN'T serve in that office without that certificate of renunciation of Canadian citizenship.
A President of the United States cannot be allowed to have citizenship loyalties to two countries.
If he submitted the forms and fee when he first said he was looking into it, assuming they were filled out correctly, he would have the certificate long ago.
Somebody should actually ask him.
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Hemond
Champion Author Providence

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Message Posted: May 8, 2014 9:37:36 AM

As stated clearly by Cfiffisher:

QUOTE "He is an USA citizen."


That leaves no doubt in Cliffisher's mind then. Cruz satisfies the Constitutional requirement to run for president.

Any and all other points are irrelevant. Cruz has the green light to run according to Cliffisher.
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Cliffisher
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Message Posted: May 8, 2014 9:12:44 AM

Duh.
Care to dance the GOPer brain fade two step?

As you have all been told many times before. (Check for senior moments)

He is an USA citizen.

He is also a Canadian citizen.

The Cuban can only be one.

President of the USA?

OR

Prime Minister of Canada?
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Hemond
Champion Author Providence

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Message Posted: May 8, 2014 8:28:08 AM

QUOTE:::::Still a Canadian.:::


Still have not answered the question I see. That is , is Cruz an American citizen or not? Yes or no?

This thread may have slowed down, but that doesn't mean we forgot your sashaying, waltzing, and sidestepping around the answer. Nor have we forgotten you boxed yourself in to a corner.

Lets see the latest dance step you come up with in response.

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Cliffisher
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Message Posted: May 7, 2014 6:19:52 PM

Still a Canadian.
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wbacon
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Message Posted: Apr 11, 2014 7:39:18 PM

I hope so
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sgm4law
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Message Posted: Apr 11, 2014 4:58:08 PM

He got an interesting result to a "facebook poll" he started:
people respond about ACA
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Hemond
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Message Posted: Apr 8, 2014 12:01:27 AM

QUOTE :::: he's (Dershowitz) certainly far from being an unbiased prof... and as a religic, is bound to lie...::::


I gotta agree with this comment. Dershowitz is lying when he makes the statement :::"Twice because the computer kept him (Obama) out," Dershowitz said. "It wasn't my fault.":::::



He knew very well Obama was not intellectually up to speed for his class and kept him out. Dershowitz wanted only the best and brightest, like Ted Cruz in his classes. A slower student like Obama was out of his league and would have been an anchor.
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BuzzLOL
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Message Posted: Apr 7, 2014 7:45:26 PM

. Probably had to be Jewish to have a good chance of, or even wanting to, get into Prof. Dershowitz's class... he's certainly far from being an unbiased prof... and as a religic, is bound to lie...
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Cliffisher
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Message Posted: Apr 7, 2014 7:14:45 PM

Is Sen. Rafael Edward Cruz still a Canadian citizen?
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Hemond
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Message Posted: Apr 7, 2014 3:04:01 PM

According to that piece, Ted Cruz was one of Dershowitz'a students but Obama couldn't get into his class on multiple attempts. Hmmm, I wonder what the criteria were for admission?

Dershowitz paints a glowing and most complimentary assessment of Ted Cruz. Calls Cruz brilliant , if you read his comments.
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AnotherOne
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Message Posted: Apr 7, 2014 11:37:58 AM



VERY liberal Harvard Professor Allan Dershowitz calls Senator Ted Cruz "OFF THE CHARTS BRILLIANT"!

U.S. Sen. Ted Cruz (R., Texas): "Off-the-charts brilliant.

"There was also the Harvard Law student who couldn't get into a Dershowitz class despite multiple attempts: Barack Obama."

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Hemond
Champion Author Providence

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Message Posted: Mar 11, 2014 10:17:01 AM

QUOTE ::::Is Cruz noticeably absent for votes more than most? Nope
Obama missed more votes than his peers
Wasserman-shouts misses more votes than her peers ::::


Good point. Perusing Cruz's voting record shows an excellent participation tally. You can't make the same statement for Obama or Shultz. Their voting record is abysmal. (Obama is notorious for voting 'present' )
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I75at7AM
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Message Posted: Mar 11, 2014 8:18:41 AM

The last time I donated any money to a presidential candidate was George McGovern.
It's been a while.......
I probably won't be giving any money to any candidates.
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KatmanDo
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Message Posted: Mar 11, 2014 2:53:24 AM

"Real experience and real eloquence. You wouldn't understand. "

Talk is pretty cheap. Now may be the time for True Believers -- those who do understand -- to mortgage their homes in order to make the largest campaign contributions they can to their favorite standard bearers.

Can Senor Rafael count on your financial support?

[Edited by: KatmanDo at 3/11/2014 2:54:23 AM EST]
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I75at7AM
Champion Author Dayton

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Message Posted: Mar 10, 2014 9:49:50 AM

Real experience and real eloquence. You wouldn't understand. You're satisfied with the Poser In Chief that's up there now.
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Cliffisher
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Message Posted: Mar 10, 2014 9:41:33 AM

What else do the GOPers have about Rafael than smoke and mirrors?
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MiddletownMarty
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Message Posted: Mar 10, 2014 6:37:15 AM

"Compare Cruz with Obama"

Why? Cruz won't be running against Obama.
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e_jeepin
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Message Posted: Mar 10, 2014 2:52:11 AM

Let's put it another way -- so it is easier for Mr & Mrs Obvious in the audience.

Compare Cruz with Obama

What was Obama doing his 140 days as Senator?

Serving his State as a good Senator or furthering his ambition to be President?

Is Cruz noticeably absent for votes more than most? Nope
Obama missed more votes than his peers
Wasserman-shouts misses more votes than her peers

Cruz hasnt walked away from his elected duties, your greatest heros have
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MiddletownMarty
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Message Posted: Mar 9, 2014 7:42:49 PM

"More like non-served, with a single burning ambition to be on the National campaign stage, while her real elected job is just a direct deposit paycheck function in her bank account."

But... what about Cruz? You know... the topic of this thread?
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e_jeepin
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Message Posted: Mar 9, 2014 7:07:49 PM

"He has the single burning ambition to be President. Rather than being a good Senator for his state, he is just using his elected position to further that ambition. His state is ill-served. "

I bet you don't think this way about #1 Democrat darling Debbie Wasserman-shouts -- The Congresswoman who is paid by the taxpayers to report to work in the House of Representative -- but instead works primarily at the DNC. She appears in MSNBC studios more than her Florida office.

Her experience is a University of Florida MA degree in political science with a "Certificate in Political campaigning" (no I didn't make that up).

More like non-served, with a single burning ambition to be on the National campaign stage, while her real elected job is just a direct deposit paycheck function in her bank account.
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Hemond
Champion Author Providence

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Message Posted: Mar 9, 2014 5:08:10 PM

QUOTE ::::Sometimes you do get who you vote for. Elections sometimes do have consequences.:::


I agree, just look at the current occupant of the White HOuse for proof of your premise. We voted for a president now surpassing Carter as the worst in history.
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KatmanDo
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Message Posted: Mar 9, 2014 1:33:57 AM

"Rather than being a good Senator for his state, he is just using his elected position to further that ambition. His state is ill-served."

Sometimes you do get who you vote for. Elections sometimes do have consequences. So, perhaps his constituents will make another choice down the road.
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sgm4law
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Message Posted: Mar 8, 2014 10:54:25 AM

He has the single burning ambition to be President. Rather than being a good Senator for his state, he is just using his elected position to further that ambition. His state is ill-served.
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wbacon
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Message Posted: Mar 8, 2014 5:28:26 AM

I hope so
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JueceFlavour
Rookie Author Washington

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Message Posted: Mar 8, 2014 2:49:12 AM

Hell, I hope not. He's for the amnesty bill. More illegals in this country to take our jobs..lol I hope he doesnt run. he could do more good in his seat now. And backing someone else that isn't going to let the immigration bill get in.

[Edited by: JueceFlavour at 3/8/2014 2:49:30 AM EST]
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KatmanDo
Champion Author Detroit

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Message Posted: Mar 8, 2014 1:17:56 AM

"During his speech at CPAC, Cruz threw McCain, Romney and Dole under the bus."

The Canadian seems to have a vision which some conservatives in the USA can stand behind. I'll bet Senor Rafael is capable of raising substantial sums in campaign investments.
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Cliffisher
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Message Posted: Mar 7, 2014 11:39:34 PM

Cruz knows all about serving his county.

What?

He didn't?

He could have.

Then he may learned how to show respect for our wounded military vets.

My driver in Nam was from Ottawa, Canada.

Mike was a great Marine and returned to Canada after our tour in Nam.

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Cliffisher
Champion Author Wisconsin

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Message Posted: Mar 7, 2014 5:32:44 PM

During his speech at CPAC, Cruz threw McCain, Romney and Dole under the bus.

McCain said he and Romney can take the criticism but that Cruz "crossed a line" by dinging Dole.

“He can say what he wants to about me, he can say anything he wants to about Mitt. Mitt can take it,” McCain told NBC’s Andrea Mitchell of Cruz. “But when he throws Bob Dole in there, I wonder if he thinks that Bob Dole stood for principle on a hilltop in Italy when he was so gravely wounded and left part of his body there fighting for our country.”

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Tru2psu2
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Message Posted: Mar 5, 2014 12:54:15 PM

Doesn't matter....it will start in 2014 and go on thru 2016...most Americans will not forget lying obama!!!

And when the economy takes off in Jan 2017, it will be a long time for the other party to get back in there....
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HotRod10
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Message Posted: Mar 5, 2014 12:48:11 PM

The election is more than 2 1/2 years away; how long does the process of renouncing one's citizenship take? I'm guessing Cruz still has plenty of time to get it done IF he decides to run.

[Edited by: HotRod10 at 3/5/2014 12:48:29 PM EST]
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Cliffisher
Champion Author Wisconsin

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Message Posted: Mar 5, 2014 11:46:49 AM

At last, someone else had to do the research .

Will Rafael renounce his Canada citizenship this year?

Will HE answer this one?
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Hemond
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Message Posted: Mar 3, 2014 7:28:25 PM

At last! A direct answer. Remarkable. I trust that since you have now answered your own question, you will not repost the same question.
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Cliffisher
Champion Author Wisconsin

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Message Posted: Mar 3, 2014 4:06:40 PM

So for now it is No, he can not run for president.
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Hemond
Champion Author Providence

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Message Posted: Mar 3, 2014 6:41:55 AM

QUOTE :::::We will wait for Him to research the subject.:::


Although Cruz has remarkable powers to inspire people, he is not a deity. No need to capitalize his pronoun when referring to Cruz. Save that for true gods, such as Gaia, the goddess of global warming.

And unlike the current occupant of 1600 Pennsylvania Av., Cruz has never been immaculated.

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rumbleseat
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Message Posted: Mar 3, 2014 6:02:23 AM

"Can Raf be a USA president while he is still a citizen of Canada?"

"We will wait for Him to research the subject."

Already researched some time back, and discussed in this thread.
As a dual citizen he can't be President. The President of the USA and Supreme Commander of the Armed Forces cannot have loyalties to 2 countries.
He will need to have that Certificate of Renunciation of Canadian citizenship if he wishes to serve as President.
Last August he announced he will be renouncing it, at this time we have not heard if the application, supporting documents and applicable fee have been filed or not.
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Cliffisher
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Message Posted: Mar 2, 2014 12:54:00 PM

I'm for the GOPer pros to show me their "Smoke and Mirrors".

Can Raf be president as an USA citizen?

Rafael sure can.

Can Raf be a USA president while he is still a citizen of Canada?

We will wait for Him to research the subject.
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