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Author Topic: ARMED IN SCHOOLS it's ok for the Obama kids why not anyone else's? Back to Topics
americanmade1

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Message Posted: Dec 24, 2012 9:11:07 AM

Why is it ok for the children of obama to have ARMED GUARDS IN SCHOOL BUT NO-ONE ELSE'S KIDS are ALLOWED TO? I don't understand the logic if it's ok to have armed protection for those who DEMAND NO GUNS ALLOWED IN SCHOOLS... WHERE'S THE HYPOCRISY??? When I went to HIGH SCHOOL in NYC back in 1976 our high school had a NYC POLICE OFFICER in UNIFORM STATIONED in the school back then in a city that pretty much bans guns unless you carry large sums of payroll or you are a body guard.
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RNorm
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Message Posted: Jan 3, 2013 1:58:12 PM

"Oh, I'll readily admit when I'm wrong...I have no problem with that."


LOL, in all these years, I've yet to see you admit when you're wrong...I guess when you conservatives "think things through" you use that as a simile to mean you're admitting when you're wrong while never saying you're wrong?

Gotcha

*ROTFL*
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flyboyUT
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Message Posted: Jan 3, 2013 1:54:29 PM

Well they for sure got rid of this dangerous weapon...
.
>>>A suburban Washington, D.C. family has retained legal counsel after their six-year-old son was suspended from school for making a gun gesture with his thumb and forefinger, pointing at another student and saying “pow.”<<<

Hey does he get extra penalties if he did it in the local Wilderness Area of the playground weedpatch.
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reb4
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Message Posted: Jan 3, 2013 1:46:35 PM

"There is absolutely NO POINT to this inane topic. ",

That could be said for 90% of the topics in this forum..
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Weaslespit
Champion Author Cincinnati

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Message Posted: Jan 3, 2013 1:42:04 PM

"There is absolutely NO POINT to this inane topic."

Truth.
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worryfree
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Message Posted: Dec 31, 2012 6:04:18 PM

There is absolutely NO POINT to this inane topic.
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jeskibuff
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Message Posted: Dec 31, 2012 5:16:51 PM

RNorm said: "you're too arrogant to admit you're wrong about anything"

Oh, I'll readily admit when I'm wrong...I have no problem with that. Your problem is you don't have the faintest clue that you're wrong!
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michaelphoenix2
All-Star Author Tucson

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Message Posted: Dec 31, 2012 4:34:57 PM

Americanmade...there are not enough facepalms on the internet for you.

let me give you this one.




/facepalm
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americanmade1
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Message Posted: Dec 31, 2012 4:26:24 PM

The point is that the LEFT wants NO GUNS IN SCHOOLS but it's ok for them to have 'em
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MiddletownMarty
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Message Posted: Dec 31, 2012 8:45:49 AM

"El Gato, I wasn't referring to the Secret Service assigned to the president's kids. Sidwell has its own armed security force to protect all its students."

But the OP specifically refers to Obama's children.

Sidwell Friends School Tuition and Fees
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no1doc
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Message Posted: Dec 31, 2012 8:42:10 AM

El Gato, I wasn't referring to the Secret Service assigned to the president's kids. Sidwell has its own armed security force to protect all its students.
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El_Gato_Negro
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Message Posted: Dec 30, 2012 8:41:44 PM

For the same reason that every President and VP has had a Secret Service detail going back to before we were all born, and all their children too.

There is much more risk of the President's children, EVERY President, of being specifically targeted than there is of the ordinary citizen.

But Obama-haters can't admit that.
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RNorm
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Message Posted: Dec 30, 2012 8:37:44 PM

" I was referring to the pushback that you liberals would engage in if a teacher was dismissed because it was determined they had deviant lifestyles typical of molesters."


Actually, as has been pointed out to you, the profile typical of molesters in the teaching ranks isn't the "deviant lifestyle" that you want to pin on LGBT folks, but again, seemingly straight, normal people who abuse their authority as teachers to take advantage of young people.

Of course, you're too arrogant to admit you're wrong about anything (which is common among you conservatives who "think things through"), so you keep twisting what I said to try and defend your ridiculous statements.

[Edited by: RNorm at 12/30/2012 8:44:52 PM EST]
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jeskibuff
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Message Posted: Dec 30, 2012 8:02:18 PM

RNorm said: "the inferences about the LGBT teachers therein isn't supported by the FACTS (which I also gave a link to)."

I didn't bother even clicking on your link simply because it has no bearing on the conversation. You took one comment I made and exploded it into something of your own imagination. I was referring to the pushback that you liberals would engage in if a teacher was dismissed because it was determined they had deviant lifestyles typical of molesters. Those lifestyles include the LGBT community, generally considered quite an amoral group by anyone who has a decent sense of morality. I wasn't saying that all molesters are LGBT's, but that's how you seem to want to twist it (no surprise there). I was saying that the people who would fight the hardest to retain the deviant teachers would be the liberals. That's a fact. Deal with it.
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jeskibuff
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Message Posted: Dec 30, 2012 7:50:09 PM

RNorm said: "I said that arming teachers in the classroom is a very bad idea. Namely because you don't know how some teachers will act with guns being in such close proximity and then I supported that position by pointing out that there are numerous teachers who violate the trust given to them in the classroom by molesting students."

You chose to deny the capacity for teachers to access weapons in an emergency situation solely based on the miscreant actions of a minority of those teachers. Not all teachers/faculty should be allowed access to those weapons...they should go through a vetting process, ensuring that they are both mentally and physically able to wield and use a deadly weapon if the necessity arises to incapacitate a hostile person such as Lanza. Every faculty member wouldn't have access, but the number who would have access would be a much better deterrent than just one or two security personnel and far better than the insane gun-free zones that you liberals are convinced will solve the problem.
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RNorm
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Message Posted: Dec 30, 2012 4:36:40 PM

"Because it works. And it works just as well for those students whose parents aren't "nation's leaders" or other "influential people". "


I believe they had armed security at Columbine and that didn't work; Virginia Tech had its own campus police and that didn't work either.

Giving everybody a gun isn't the solution and I know you know that. The problem starts at home and that's where you have to solve it.
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no1doc
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Message Posted: Dec 30, 2012 4:01:04 PM

"Donno why you all want to act as if that's not the case and try to use that as a model for every school...SMH"
....

Because it works. And it works just as well for those students whose parents aren't "nation's leaders" or other "influential people".

<<<<<<<<<<<<
"I think it's interesting that when that in 1994 clinton stated that was over $60 million already aside to put Police Officers in EVERY SCHOOL to PROTECT OUR CHILDREN NOTHING was said but when the NRA says it, Oooooh VERY BAD..."
.......

No surprise there americanmade1. The NRA is on the demonize list and Clinton's not.

[Edited by: no1doc at 12/30/2012 4:06:16 PM EST]
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RNorm
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Message Posted: Dec 30, 2012 9:46:45 AM

"When the right guy has a gun, the bad guy with a gun can be stopped. That's why Sidwell and Friends has armed security. It's really a no brainer."


No, they have armed security because the children of the nation's leaders and other influential people go there.

Donno why you all want to act as if that's not the case and try to use that as a model for every school...SMH
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MiddletownMarty
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Message Posted: Dec 30, 2012 9:40:13 AM

"I think it's interesting that when that in 1994 clinton stated that was over $60 million already aside to put Police Officers in EVERY SCHOOL to PROTECT OUR CHILDREN NOTHING was said but when the NRA says it, Oooooh VERY BAD..."

You said that in another topic. Here's a copy of the reply I gave there, I do give you credit for scaling down the amount from "billions" to "millions":


There was no "billions of dollars"; it was $120 million in grants, with $40 million going to 23 schools that had already developed successful, comprehensive programs to help troubled youth. The remaining funds were for "COPS in School", a Justice Department program to place 452 officers in schools in more than 220 communities.

"Already, it has placed 2,200 officers in more than 1,000 communities across our nation, where they are heightening school safety as well as coaching sports and acting as mentors and mediators for kids in need,” Clinton said." --Bill Clinton

Huh? Coaching sports? Mentors? Mediators for kids in need??

You should also be aware that the Republicans tried to kill the COPS program in 1995, and that Bush defunded it, and that the COPS program was not about cops carrying weapons into the schools. It was part of a broader approach to decrease crime rates by getting police involved in their communities. In other words, it was a sane policy.






[Edited by: MiddletownMarty at 12/30/2012 9:41:51 AM EST]
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americanmade1
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Message Posted: Dec 30, 2012 9:37:32 AM

I think it's interesting that when that in 1994 clinton stated that was over $60 million already aside to put Police Officers in EVERY SCHOOL to PROTECT OUR CHILDREN NOTHING was said but when the NRA says it, Oooooh VERY BAD...
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no1doc
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Message Posted: Dec 30, 2012 9:03:30 AM

How to stop the slaughter of the innocents

Which environment is a bad guy going to pick to slaughter innocents, a gun free zone, or one in which he knows there's an armed presence? Years ago a young mother was mugged and murdered with a shot gun blast to the head with her young daughter looking on in the parking lot of a Popeye's Chicken restaurant. The 14 year old perp was later asked why, out of other people the lot, he picked this mother.

His answer was, "She was the only white person in the lot, I knew she wouldn't have a gun. When the right guy has a gun, the bad guy with a gun can be stopped. That's why Sidwell and Friends has armed security. It's really a no brainer.


[Edited by: no1doc at 12/30/2012 9:09:01 AM EST]
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Weaslespit
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Message Posted: Dec 29, 2012 9:20:24 PM

"Perhaps the NRA can fund it."

Even better.

"Every teacher should be armed!!"

Talk about an overreaction - I hope you're not serious!
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daylily2009
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Message Posted: Dec 29, 2012 8:52:39 PM

Every teacher should be armed!!
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MiddletownMarty
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Message Posted: Dec 29, 2012 8:17:08 PM

"Perhaps the GOP can add funding for this whilst trying to make drastic cuts to balance the budget?"

Perhaps the NRA can fund it.
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Weaslespit
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Message Posted: Dec 29, 2012 7:39:53 PM

Good luck funding all of these armed guards - most school districts are having a hard enough time just finding money to pay the teachers since federal and state funding has decreased...

My old school district shares 4 police officers for 2 high schools and 3 middle schools while paying 25% of their salary. There are no guards for the many, many elementary schools.

Perhaps the GOP can add funding for this whilst trying to make drastic cuts to balance the budget? lol
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RNorm
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Message Posted: Dec 29, 2012 4:56:49 PM

"Probably not, but RNorm seems to be certain that the teacher population is just saturated with them or perhaps that all teachers can't be trusted because a few are molesters. "


No, I said that arming teachers in the classroom is a very bad idea. Namely because you don't know how some teachers will act with guns being in such close proximity and then I supported that position by pointing out that there are numerous teachers who violate the trust given to them in the classroom by molesting students.

YOU countered my point by making the stupid remark:

"Of course, then you liberals would cry about discrimination against the LGBT teachers, wouldn't you? "

Which not only isn't true, but the inferences about the LGBT teachers therein isn't supported by the FACTS (which I also gave a link to).

So again, you've simply shown yet another pristine example of conservatives "thinking things through" that doesn't add up to the FACTS (and is also a triple-twist to what I said).

No surprise there.




"Leave it to a liberal to always get things so wrong!"

Leave it to a conservative to run away from his own erroneous statements when they are exposed by the FACTS and try to turn his error on others...

PS: One of my daughters is a teacher, so I don't have the poor view of teachers that you THINK I do.
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jeskibuff
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Message Posted: Dec 29, 2012 4:41:56 PM

reb4 said: "Does anybody have any links from respectable sites to back up the wild claims about molestations?"

Probably not, but RNorm seems to be certain that the teacher population is just saturated with them or perhaps that all teachers can't be trusted because a few are molesters. He also seems to think because I mentioned the immorality of LGBT people that I was inferring the teacher population is saturated with them. Leave it to a liberal to always get things so wrong!
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worryfree
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Message Posted: Dec 29, 2012 1:14:20 AM

The problem with putting armed guards or teachers in schools is that mass murderers are insane and would not even slow down because a teacher may be armed. As for the armed guard at the door who do you think the wacko would kill first?? We have to address the mental health issues first and foremost especially the difficulty of getting a wacko committed. Next we have to make the guns available less likely to kill dozens in a minute or two. The shooter in Aurora was done killing after 32 seconds.
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mopey
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Message Posted: Dec 28, 2012 9:41:15 PM

Every school should have armed guards !!
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PappaVanTwee
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Message Posted: Dec 28, 2012 7:29:53 PM

Not mentioned in Mini's article is the fact that the Sidwell Friends School has the children of many influential people attending. Just like the Secret Service detail for Obama's kids, I'd want some sort of security there for the kids of those influential people as well.
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WES03
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Message Posted: Dec 28, 2012 6:01:24 PM

Many schools in D.C. have armed guards.

[Edited by: WES03 at 12/28/2012 6:02:32 PM EST]
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ministorage
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Message Posted: Dec 28, 2012 12:41:04 PM

NBC pit bull David Gregory, who mocked LaPierre for proposing armed guards in schools, sends his kids to the most armed school in Washington D.C.

"The NBC host would go on the rest of the segment to suggest that armed guards might not be effective in preventing mass murders at school.... But when it comes to Gregory's own kids, however, they are secured every school day by armed guards."

These armed guards are employed by the school, as Hawkins pointed out in Edger's link below; this has nothing to do with the fact the Obamas attend, "...this is standard operating procedure for the school, period."

In *addition* to the armed guards already employed by the school, there is of course, also the SS protecting Malia and Sasha.

[Edited by: ministorage at 12/28/2012 12:46:06 PM EST]
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RNorm
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Message Posted: Dec 28, 2012 9:04:08 AM

"Does anybody have any links from respectable sites to back up the wild claims about molestations?"

It requires more time than I have to go into detail, but the claims aren't wild.

In general, I don't make wild claims. Automatically assuming teachers having sex with kids are part of the LGBT community is where the wild claims began here...



"How is this pertinent in this thread"

Well, if you're unstable enough to molest a child, it stands to reason that if rebuffed by a child and having access to a gun, it could go worse. Just giving everyone in control of the classroom immediate access to guns is simply not the best way to go.






"though I do not agree that comparing Obama's children having guards to other people's children."

That's because you're more reasonable and levelheaded than some of your illogical conservative brethren.


[Edited by: RNorm at 12/28/2012 9:05:45 AM EST]
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reb4
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Message Posted: Dec 28, 2012 8:43:58 AM

Does anybody have any links from respectable sites to back up the wild claims about molestations? How is this pertinent in this thread, though I do not agree that comparing Obama's children having guards to other people's children.

I know there were some marksmen that were as qualified as many in the protective services at my son's schools when they grew up. I am sure there are qualified teachers that are capable of handling just weapons today as much as the school's the original poster discussed. The difference is these schools are private schools compared to public schools...

As far as teachers molesting students, that is probably something that should likely be more aptly discussed in another topic... but it does raise question to people being allowed with our children...
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RNorm
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Message Posted: Dec 28, 2012 8:01:38 AM

"A tiny minority end up charged as molesters. The vast majority of them are straight, married women having affairs with male students or male professors trading grades for sexual favours."


Bingo and Boom.

That shouldn't have to be laid out but some folks have blinders and biases on, so they can't accept the truth.
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RNorm
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Message Posted: Dec 28, 2012 7:53:30 AM

"Then let them face the same risks as the rest of our kids if they are not more important. If they are being protected because they are targets of opportunity, it seems reasonable to protect all kids equally then, or not at all."


But that is what you fail to understand; whether you like it or not, they ARE more important than the rest of the kids.

Now when you become president, then your kids will become more important too.

You may not like it, but that's the way its been for quite a long time; REGARDLESS of whether there's a (D) or (R) behind the president's name.
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MiddletownMarty
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Message Posted: Dec 28, 2012 7:03:58 AM

"Then let them face the same risks as the rest of our kids if they are not more important."

Only -this- President's kids though, right? Let's not afford the black guy's family the same benefits afforded any -other- President.
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rumbleseat
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Message Posted: Dec 28, 2012 6:55:51 AM

"Then let them face the same risks as the rest of our kids if they are not more important."

Well, that's just a stupid idea. Leave them exposed and a whacko hits them, and the US would appear to be the weakest target in the world and you would have terror attacks, both foreign and domestic, daily all over the country.
Any country that didn't care enough to protect the President and family would be a laughing-stock.
But maybe that's what you would like, so you could post another anti-Obama rant, this time blaming him for pulling security from his children.
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MiddletownMarty
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Message Posted: Dec 28, 2012 6:33:31 AM

Mother Jones is as good a source as any. If you have statistical data that's at odds with my posting, I'd be happy to read it.
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theTower
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Message Posted: Dec 28, 2012 6:21:22 AM

"It isn't that they are more important, but they are bigger targets by far."

Then let them face the same risks as the rest of our kids if they are not more important. If they are being protected because they are targets of opportunity, it seems reasonable to protect all kids equally then, or not at all.
Should just leave it up to each school anyway. Let them decide how best to protect their children.
We'll see which ones get attacked.
The sheep farms or the armed compounds.
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rumbleseat
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Message Posted: Dec 28, 2012 5:45:55 AM

"then you liberals would cry about discrimination against the LGBT teachers, wouldn't you?"

A tiny minority end up charged as molesters. The vast majority of them are straight, married women having affairs with male students or male professors trading grades for sexual favours.
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flyboyUT
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Message Posted: Dec 27, 2012 10:50:10 PM

"As I reported recently in our in-depth investigation, not one of the 62 mass shootings in the United States over the last 30 years has been stopped this way."

Depends on how you define the term there Marty. Maybe one reason they didnt find any is because when the perp who wants ot kill a bunch of folks is stopped by a armed other person - --- it never gets to be a mass killing.

But if you like to use Mother Jones as a source of accurate info - enjoy .
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RNorm
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Message Posted: Dec 27, 2012 10:40:13 PM

"Of course, then you liberals would cry about discrimination against the LGBT teachers, wouldn't you? "


Um, the majority of teachers molesting children aren't LGBT; in addition to showing your ignorance on the subject, you also reveal YOUR OWN biases...no surprise there though.
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jeskibuff
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Message Posted: Dec 27, 2012 10:27:07 PM

RNorm said: "If some teachers can't be trusted not to molest kids, do you think they will protect them?"

We had several instances at Newtown where teachers/administrators took bullets while shielding the children. Yes...there are good teachers who will do whatever it takes to protect their students. You just have to strong-arm the NEA to enable the few molesters/perverts to be terminated. Of course, then you liberals would cry about discrimination against the LGBT teachers, wouldn't you?
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jeskibuff
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Message Posted: Dec 27, 2012 10:22:00 PM

RNorm said: "Again, the House GOP cut funding for embassy security and then blasted the administration for not providing security."

At the risk of this devolving into another Benghazi thread, please tell us why the State Department was negligent in pulling their people out of that "mission" if they couldn't provide the needed security and there were plenty of indications that Stevens was crying for help? If you can't protect your people, you extricate them. You don't leave them there to die like the Obozo administration did.
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rumbleseat
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Message Posted: Dec 27, 2012 9:11:14 PM

"That such facts even have to be stated shows how ludicrous this thread is."

Indubitably.
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flyboyUT
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Message Posted: Dec 27, 2012 8:34:34 PM

AZmike I understand what your saying - but my kids ARE more important to me than some kids I have never even seen. Sorry - thats real life.

Now we come to the fun teasing part --- "affect his judgment" Your making a rather large assumption that he really has any judgement.
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RNorm
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Message Posted: Dec 27, 2012 7:27:52 PM

"It isn't that they are more important, but they are bigger targets by far. Nobody in a foreign country plots to kidnap or kill YOUR children specifically, or MY children, they don't know who they are and don't care, but they DO know who the President's children are.
Nobody in a foreign country plots to kidnap or kill YOU specifically, or me, or our spouses, but they do plot to kidnap or kill the President or his wife, and we know it isn't just foreigners that shoot at Presidents, witness Lincoln, Kennedy, Reagan."



That such facts even have to be stated shows how ludicrous this thread is.
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rumbleseat
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Message Posted: Dec 27, 2012 6:57:00 PM

"These children are more important than your children."

It isn't that they are more important, but they are bigger targets by far. Nobody in a foreign country plots to kidnap or kill YOUR children specifically, or MY children, they don't know who they are and don't care, but they DO know who the President's children are.
Nobody in a foreign country plots to kidnap or kill YOU specifically, or me, or our spouses, but they do plot to kidnap or kill the President or his wife, and we know it isn't just foreigners that shoot at Presidents, witness Lincoln, Kennedy, Reagan.
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RNorm
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Message Posted: Dec 27, 2012 6:50:39 PM

"There's a HUGE difference between paying armed guards to protect defenseless children and say, blowing NINETY BILLION dollars on failed "green" initiatives or even TRILLIONS of dollars on failed "stimulus" programs."


Again, the House GOP cut funding for embassy security and then blasted the administration for not providing security.

Some of you righties speak out of both sides of their mouths. If the NRA things every school should have armed guards, then maybe the NRA should put THEIR money where their mouths are.







"Besides, the best and cheapest solution is NOT to have paid guards, but to have firearms available to trained teachers and administrators. That distributes the protection to all parts of a school at once and makes a perp wonder who can take him down and who can't."

If some teachers can't be trusted not to molest kids, do you think they will protect them? Man please, some of them might be the ones shooting the kids themselves.

The NRA proposal is dumb; but you'll never say so, even when you know it is.
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jeskibuff
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Message Posted: Dec 27, 2012 6:33:18 PM

RNorm said: "the same people who say we need to stop out of control government spending, want to put armed guards at every school as if that will cost nothing?"

There's a HUGE difference between paying armed guards to protect defenseless children and say, blowing NINETY BILLION dollars on failed "green" initiatives or even TRILLIONS of dollars on failed "stimulus" programs.

Spending by itself isn't an evil; it's the reckless spending that EVERYONE should abhor, including liberals who will suffer as much as conservatives when it occurs.

Besides, the best and cheapest solution is NOT to have paid guards, but to have firearms available to trained teachers and administrators. That distributes the protection to all parts of a school at once and makes a perp wonder who can take him down and who can't.

And what's this? The same people who don't seem to have a problem with Obozo spending TRILLIONS of dollars now objecting to spending money on paid guards to protect vulnerable children? Count me "not surprised"!
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