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Author Topic: Oil Changes when using E85 Back to Topics
CactusBobs

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Arizona

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Message Posted: Mar 25, 2014 3:13:31 PM

Yesterday someone told me that if you use E85 you have to change your motor oil more often . i had never heard this before . can someone please tell me what this is about . can you use a thinker oil to avoid this or does the ethanol do something else to the oil other than thin it out . or is this not true at all .
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PummpinEthyl
Champion Author Nevada

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Message Posted: May 15, 2014 8:18:13 PM

Some alcohol in race engines gets past the rings and dilutes the oil. It is typical to drain the oil and let the alcohol evaporate.

After the alcohol evaporation the oil can be and is typically reused as long as the oil is not contaminated from other sources and is within its normal change cycle.
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Dennis783
Champion Author Des Moines

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Message Posted: May 15, 2014 8:07:21 AM

stick to the manufacturer's recommendation
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CactusBobs
Champion Author Arizona

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Message Posted: May 7, 2014 10:08:00 PM

Thank you to everyone who has taken the time to post.

open discussions of this type bring about more research, thought and understanding.

Topics with substance should be the norm here and not the "what did you eat today" topics that grace the Gas buddy forum pages all too often. Thank you....Again
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thuathienhue
Champion Author Michigan

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Message Posted: May 4, 2014 1:06:28 AM

We still change every 3000 miles
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YodaON
Champion Author Ottawa

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Message Posted: May 3, 2014 5:22:03 PM

5000 km or 3000 miles is what I would recommend
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streetdesign
Champion Author Illinois

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Message Posted: May 3, 2014 2:22:26 PM

I have not heard or read any information that E85 would entail more oil changes. Regardless there should be a ban on it.
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Jumpmaster82
Champion Author South Carolina

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Message Posted: May 2, 2014 5:51:20 AM

I'd stick with the manufactures recommended maintenance schedule since they are aware that ethanol is out there!
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AvantiMick
Champion Author Indiana

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Message Posted: May 2, 2014 5:46:12 AM

I used E-85 in my Yukon for years, and changed oil at 5k for 10 years, with NO problems!
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mpsan
Champion Author Wisconsin

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Message Posted: May 2, 2014 1:53:38 AM

MORE OFTEN
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Eggo
Champion Author San Antonio

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Message Posted: May 1, 2014 4:45:24 PM

not in my book
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too_high
Champion Author Virginia

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Message Posted: May 1, 2014 12:29:21 PM

Never heard of changing the oil more often for e85. That may be because I am reading from my 20 year-old owners manual. Interesting info and mis-info, here.
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Settjec
Champion Author Little Rock

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Message Posted: May 1, 2014 12:12:10 PM

Most indeed
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CactusBobs
Champion Author Arizona

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Message Posted: May 1, 2014 10:10:20 AM

merlinCO:"Only need to change the oil more frequently if converting from regular gas for a couple of changes."

Now i am lost! People i know that have Flex Fuel trucks might use E85 for a tank and then use E10 for the next 3.
I thought the whole idea of having flex fuel was you could burn anything from E0 to E85 at will, anytime you wanted.

Now i keep hearing from more than a few on here,you should pick one fuel and stick with it. This is nuts !

There can be only one fact, or truth, you can or you can't,you should or you should not.

GrumpyCat brought up a good fact, if your going to use E85 there are motor oils made for just that fuel. this looks like it is fact, the first one of the thread it looks like.

the other fact is the longer and more i learn about Ethanol the more i dislike it and i might even be fearing it.
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merlinCO
Champion Author Colorado

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Message Posted: May 1, 2014 8:12:16 AM

Only need to change the oil more frequently if converting from regular gas for a couple of changes.
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cigarman409
Champion Author Massachusetts

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Message Posted: May 1, 2014 7:37:00 AM

ok
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ThunderBird89
Champion Author Columbus

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Message Posted: May 1, 2014 3:00:53 AM

thicker oil provides more internal engine resistance, and reduces power and fuel economy
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cutter1330
Champion Author Oklahoma

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Message Posted: May 1, 2014 12:49:47 AM

E-ZERO
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GrumpyCat
Champion Author Alabama

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Message Posted: Apr 17, 2014 10:53:13 AM

"Thanks rumbleseat for pointing out GF-5. I'd also like to remind Grumpycat about Dextos1 a spec that GM made with E85 in mind."

… starting with the 2011 model year. 10 years without an oil suitable for ethanol and the new oil costs 25% more.
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GrumpyCat
Champion Author Alabama

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Message Posted: Apr 17, 2014 10:50:10 AM

"Once again grumpy is in here with his daily dose of poison.

Ethanol a detergent? That is a new one on me. Oh well, call it what you like. If gasoline wasn't so nasty, I suppose they wouldn't have to add a detergent. So therefore, with ethanol a detergent is not needed. Maybe thats why my 23 year old mower hums right along. "

Look it up, if you were not so intellectually lazy.

The very real problems so many have had with ethanol is that its detergent properties lift otherwise harmless deposits which were in your fuel system. Or the gas station's fuel system.

Ethanol's detergent properties are exactly why E10 and E85 can not be shipped via pipeline. Why there is such a fuss about the cost and availability of railroad tank cars, and truck tankers.

Ethanol apologists make up the darndest stories. Such as how ethanol is so magically perfect and clean motor oil lasts LONGER. Obvious untrue to any chemist because the term "clean" is relative. Motor oils had to be reformulated to tolerate ethanol. Just as motor oils were formulated to handle lead in gasoline then that was forgotten with unleaded gasoline and came to bite Mobil-1 in the butt in the aviation market.
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ZR1S10
Rookie Author Chicago

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Message Posted: Apr 13, 2014 10:26:52 PM

Thanks rumbleseat for pointing out GF-5. I'd also like to remind Grumpycat about Dextos1 a spec that GM made with E85 in mind. Both specifications are backwards compatible with older engines including a 2001 Sonoma's 2.2L. My S10 is a 1996 with the 4.3L and I use 0w30 Redline oil for 10k miles with E40 as my fuel. Fuel filter change is extended and spark plugs are about the same. Amazing how modern tech can make a owner's manual obsolete isn't it?

[Edited by: ZR1S10 at 4/13/2014 10:27:30 PM EST]
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ggg452
Champion Author Manitoba

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Message Posted: Apr 13, 2014 2:54:23 PM

5000 kms or three months, whichever comes first.
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gasisoutrageous
Champion Author Lansing

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Message Posted: Apr 13, 2014 11:49:51 AM

All I can add to this debate is that in my '08 Chrysler Sebring, I haven't changed the oil in 11,000 miles now. There is no hint of any dirt, and there has been little need to add oil in the time since.
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oilpan4
Champion Author Virginia

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Message Posted: Apr 12, 2014 1:25:34 PM

And thats why I run diesel engine oil in the cars, plus i can buy it in 2.5 to 5 gallons at a time. Buying large containers makes it as low as 40% of the price compared to buying by the quart.
I just wish they would sell synthetic rotella 5w-40 oil in 2.5 jug or 5 gallon buckets..
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CactusBobs
Champion Author Arizona

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Message Posted: Apr 12, 2014 12:05:50 PM

goldseeker: one of your cars has 165k on the same set of spark plugs?
The gap on those plugs must be big enough to drive a truck through!
Get with it .....replace those plugs and you might even get better mileage!

and

As always thank you for your input........CHANGE YOUR PLUGS !!!!!!!!!!!!! :)
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goldseeker
Champion Author West Virginia

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Message Posted: Apr 12, 2014 11:54:34 AM

Once again grumpy is in here with his daily dose of poison.

Ethanol a detergent? That is a new one on me. Oh well, call it what you like. If gasoline wasn't so nasty, I suppose they wouldn't have to add a detergent. So therefore, with ethanol a detergent is not needed. Maybe thats why my 23 year old mower hums right along.

I have two cars, one with 165K and the other with 99K. Both still have orginal plugs and they also keep humming right along.

Oh, I use mobile 1 in each car and changed my oil every 5-6000 miles. Works fine. And I get great mileage with each car.

Grumpy, you are very gullible, you always fall for the same old stories concocted by the oil companies.

Oh well, I walk to the beat of my own drum and nothing you can say or do will change my mind.
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rumbleseat
Champion Author Winnipeg

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Message Posted: Apr 11, 2014 9:21:33 PM

Regular motor oil would breakdown more from heating and cooling over the course of 5,000 miles than it possibly could from the acid inherent in E85. If you are driving a flex-fuel vehicle, and using factory-recommended oil blend for E85, you have detergents blended for the slightly higher acid. Recommendations for more oil changes are aimed at the paranoid who will enrich service departments with more frequent visits.

Check the labels on your oils. Those meeting GF-5 have been formulated for E85 emulsion retention, which includes higher capability of handling acids. GF-5 oil specifications didn't exist when your manual for a 2001 vehicle was printed.
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GrumpyCat
Champion Author Alabama

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Message Posted: Apr 11, 2014 1:22:27 PM

Hannie59 doesn't let fact interfere with his religion.

Motor oil is very carefully formulated to neutralize combustion blow-by products. Oil formulated for gasoline engines can not handle diesel blow-by. However diesel motor oils are usually formulated for dual use in gasoline and diesel engines, and often transmissions as well. Such fleet oils are excellent solutions for diesel and gasoline engines. And motorcycles with combined engine/transmissions.

Cocky Mobil-1 once made a motor oil for gasoline aviation engines by tweaking their automotive product. Damaged a lot of engines and lost their shirts paying for the damage all because Mobil-1 forgot aviation fuels still contained lead, and the oil designers who had experience with lead had long since moved on. Google it.

Same applies to ethanol. 15 years after my 2001 Sonoma 2.2L was designed one would expect API/SAE now knows about ethanol in fuels and has added compensation for ethanol in the motor oil to current specifications. Doesn't change the FACT that double the oil drains were specified in the owner's manual with just cause.

Ethanol is a detergent. It scours everything it comes in contact with and carries the crud along with it. That is why ethanol must be tanked and can not be pipelined. GM is more than justified by prescribing pre-emptive fuel filter changes.

As for claims that ethanol is the magic cure-all elixir? Shills from snake-oil salesmen.
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the1roadhog
Champion Author Atlanta

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Message Posted: Mar 30, 2014 9:19:08 AM

why use it in first place?
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krzysiek_ck
Champion Author Illinois

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Message Posted: Mar 27, 2014 4:38:57 PM

CactusBobs wrote: "The Ethanol "fanboys" are AWOL !

Did i strike "an inconvenient truth" when it comes to maintenance ."

No, not at all. Simply put this was already discussed in great details and nobody cares that you did not do you homework. Nothing new from you.
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Hannie59
All-Star Author Appleton

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Message Posted: Mar 27, 2014 2:09:32 PM

How one grumpy cat can twist facts.

Fuel filter AND crankcase oil: If you use ONLY E-85 and don't switch back and forth, the fuel filter lasts much longer with the E-85. They assume that you will be switching back and forth and the crap left from the gasoline will plug the filter when you go back to E-85. Same with the sludgy oil which is caused by gasoline. If you switch to E-85 and back and forth the oil gets worse.

E-85, used exclusively, extends all engine life including oil and fuel filters.

Auto companies are very cautious when writing about E-85. It can extend engine life to 500,000 when used exclusively. Thay don't really want you using E-85 because you will buy fewer vehicles then.

[Edited by: Hannie59 at 3/27/2014 2:12:26 PM EST]
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GrumpyCat
Champion Author Alabama

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Message Posted: Mar 27, 2014 1:58:32 PM

Find the owner's manual to a 2001 GMC Sonoma 2.2L FlexFuel. The normal drain interval is 7500 miles but for "severe duty" and E85 it is stated to be 3750 miles.

E85 also doubles the replacement frequency for spark plugs and fuel filter.

I know because I owned said vehicle for 7 years and I actually read my owner's manuals cover to cover.
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CactusBobs
Champion Author Arizona

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Message Posted: Mar 27, 2014 1:50:28 PM

The Ethanol "fanboys" are AWOL !

Did i strike "an inconvenient truth" when it comes to maintenance .
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TomB2
Champion Author St. Louis

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Message Posted: Mar 26, 2014 3:44:47 PM

Check your owners manual. Mine calls for increased and more frequent maintenance when using E-85 fuel.
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stickyvalves
Champion Author Iowa

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Message Posted: Mar 25, 2014 9:32:32 PM

Have not done this in Iowa. Must be the quality of ethanol.
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borsht
Champion Author Oakland

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Message Posted: Mar 25, 2014 5:49:13 PM

That is a great question:
I've heard people say the acid created with ethanol is a potential problem. My first though is that ethanol is not acidic but rather basic, with it OH. However, Mobil 1 had a good explanation to the issue.
When you burn ethanol some formic acid it created that gets into the oil.

https://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Car_Care/AskMobil/Oil_Best_for_Engines_Using_E85_Fuel.aspx

This question was regarding a E85 conversion for ethanol, thus it wouldn't have the special coating on the pistons to protected them.
So, the issue is much more complicate3d when one is burning 85% ethanol gasoline mix. The ethanol will by itself be basic, but produces acid,. If the gasoline has any sulfur, it will burn acidic.

So, some manufactures are evidently asking that the oil be change twice as frequently. Mobil says to use their Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel Truck 5W-40 .

Anyway, hopefully this should lead to some informed info being posted.

If anyone has some manufacturer recommendations they would be a helpful add to this topic.
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