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Author Topic: Experiment in truth, ongoing for now 8 years Back to Topics
Hannie59

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Appleton

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Message Posted: Mar 1, 2014 8:41:20 AM

When I bought my 2006 Hyundai Elantra, a little research and the visual proof shown in the video below. I decided I was going to run my brand new, under warranty, NON flex fuel vehicle, that I had just bought, on higher than the recommended percentage of ethanol. I started on E-20 because I had access to stations with blender pumps that sold this mix. I then began blending up to E-50 on occasion going forward. All year long, every fill up. I'd say the current average over the life of this vehicle, which is still running great at 150K, was probably 30-35% Alcohol. All year long, every fill up. Never a fuel system issue, never even a check engine light While all was going well with this, and I was running the same blend in a 1995 Grand Am 3100 V6, and no issues. When the heater core broke at 129,000 I decided to trade that vehicle in in 2009 for a new Hyundai Sonata, non FFV. Tried the 30% to 35% ethanol in the 2009 from day one, now 5 years and 95,000 miles ago, no issues. This was my way of convincing myself of what has been proven, but overshadowed by lies. And that is that any post 1995 car will run great, and a long time on minimum of 30% and most, up to 50% ethanol in the fuel. Flex fuel will in reality let you run on 98% ethanol, but 85% is the best you can buy.

I am not trying to give bad advice, do what you want. But stop thinking ethanol is bad. And, don't be afraid to use a blender pump to get some E-30, or to add a few gallons of E-85 to your regular. Especially if your car says to use premium. You can use ethanol to bump up the octane AND keep your engine running great.

Remember what the Oil Industry executive was quoted as saying... "Our biggest fear is when people realize they CAN use higher ethanol blends in their car." Thus the multi million dollar smear campaign thay have waged. And as for food, Corn is waaaaay down. WAY down. And corn is no longet the preferred animal feed for meat production anyway. It's actually the DDGs that are a by product of ethanol production.

2000 Tahoe tear down. E-85, non FFV


[Edited by: Hannie59 at 3/1/2014 8:46:44 AM EST]
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stickyvalves
Champion Author Iowa

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Message Posted: Apr 7, 2014 11:13:06 AM

"like ethanol to be made from some other vegetable."

Ethanol is being made using the most widely grown grain in this country. To attempt to use a different grain source will require some available acres for growing. There aren't any more acres available.

No one is going hungry from ethanol production. We still make all the corn syrup, corn starch, and corn flakes this country wants. Enjoy them.
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navy1954
Champion Author Georgia

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Message Posted: Apr 6, 2014 12:17:44 PM

Need more than one vehicles data. I also would like ethanol to be made from some other vegetable.
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Banjoe
Champion Author Winnipeg

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Message Posted: Apr 6, 2014 8:25:13 AM

Hannie59 - you keep nudging us towards informed decisions and intellectual discussion and things can only get better.

Well, unless they get worse in which case they would have been much worse without your input so you're still making a big difference.
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Hannie59
All-Star Author Appleton

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Message Posted: Apr 5, 2014 2:45:19 PM

Thanks for keeping me honest Banjoe.... My comments were far to broad in that case. There is alot of deception that has gone on, on alot of issues where facts have intentionally been covered up. On many OF these issues, what people think is true does not hold water when studied. On many things, the facts have been deliberately distorted for a century so control could be maintained and freedom of choice supressed. But yes, everything is not a scam and choice (and freedom of that) is always a good thing, no question!



[Edited by: Hannie59 at 4/5/2014 2:49:42 PM EST]
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Banjoe
Champion Author Winnipeg

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Message Posted: Apr 5, 2014 10:00:35 AM

Hannie59 - I hear what you say but I wouldn't go as far as calling them scams. They may not be the brightest choices but I don't want to live in a society where we have only the very best choice to choose from (actually there would be no choices at all at that point).

The wide range of choices gives everyone options as to how they want to spend their money. Most will fall for the advertising in spite of the very bad options being offered but to fix that you will need to educate everyone on every option out there. That's the easy part. The hard part is getting people to freely decide to become educated on issues, items, and option.

You are probably more aware than anyone about the challenges and obstacles in helping people to seek out facts and make up their own mind. Your ethanol work has shown, over and over again, that 'everyone' knows that ethanol kills engines, food in your gas tank is the downfall of global food supplies, and politicians are trying to enslave us with the evils of this devil fuel.

There is no scam in ethanol as there is no scam in fast food, hair restorers, or performance enhancers. They sell well to certain people and the sales are based on how much people research and educate themselves on the topic. The sad part is that most research comes from just watching the flashy commercials that offers scientific proof to make that particular product into a modern day miracle that will be ordered right now before the limited quantities run out.

I appreciate your tireless efforts to bring light to the dark side and believe, in spite of human nature, that you are helping a good number of folks to put a little thought into the ethanol option and, hopefully, into more of the choices they make every day.

Keep up the good work.
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Hannie59
All-Star Author Appleton

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Message Posted: Apr 3, 2014 11:12:08 AM

ggg, the people in power hope you continue your simplistic, uninformed views.

Actually, corn (and other viable plant based material) ethanol is the right way to make transportation fuel. It makes a cleaner fuel.

Take a look at real pictures of what the tar sands extraction has done. There, what you see is a big plate of "morally wrong."

Look at what a plant based vegan diet can do? It can cure 90% of North American diseases. cancer, Diabetes, heart disease, osteo arthritic condidions... the list is endless. Yet we pump billions into crappy, processed, industrialized foods (like corn) and billions more into marginally effective, but "patentable", pharmaceuticals.Big oil, big food, big pharma. It's all one big scam.

[Edited by: Hannie59 at 4/3/2014 11:17:11 AM EST]
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Banjoe
Champion Author Winnipeg

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Message Posted: Apr 3, 2014 8:04:35 AM

furball64801 - you keep mileage records for your vehicles at various mixtures?
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furball64801
Champion Author Missouri

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Message Posted: Apr 3, 2014 7:58:05 AM

How much corn do you eat, I can buy all I want for a dollar a bag. Also a by product of ethanol is distillers grain which is fed to cows.
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ggg452
Champion Author Manitoba

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Message Posted: Apr 2, 2014 11:06:09 AM

And we do this why???? Ethanol made from corn or food is wrong...straw? OK.
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furball64801
Champion Author Missouri

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Message Posted: Apr 2, 2014 9:42:03 AM

Most have seen my posts over the years, started in about 2007 mixing when I could. I started in the low 20% and then moved it up. I got up past 50% and I still have the car and it runs great. I zoom down the highway like a bullet, no tickets yet you have to be careful cops are sneaky dudes. So now the Van we bought a year ago is getting about a 20% mix and it is doing great, performance the same it is good as well. It is all about starting out slow and moving up.
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Hannie59
All-Star Author Appleton

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Message Posted: Mar 21, 2014 12:29:35 PM

More ways to make cellulosic than you can count!

[Edited by: Hannie59 at 3/21/2014 12:31:04 PM EST]
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SilverStreaker
Champion Author Twin Cities

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Message Posted: Mar 17, 2014 11:27:01 AM

Can you make cellulosic ethanol out of a straw man?
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Banjoe
Champion Author Winnipeg

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Message Posted: Mar 17, 2014 8:58:13 AM

Now we have a straw man drawn into the corn discussion that's now about rice? I'm getting confused again.

Isn't the corn byproduct from ethanol plants usable as livestock feed and doesn't it have some resale value?
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krzysiek_ck
Champion Author Illinois

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Message Posted: Mar 17, 2014 8:35:25 AM

camusblowers wrote: "Corn is a divisive source of fuel not because cows eat it but because of the complex economic issues- it is used as a base for tortillas and other foods down south- prices of rice in Haiti, etc. So burning corn is insulting to our southern neighbors- MX, HA, and not just a part of chicken feed."

How exactly is corn regulating the price of rice in Haiti? How is field corn used for foods down south? Please provide some details on this.
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camusblowers
Rookie Author Idaho

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Message Posted: Mar 16, 2014 9:47:03 PM

Corn is a divisive source of fuel not because cows eat it but because of the complex economic issues- it is used as a base for tortillas and other foods down south- prices of rice in Haiti, etc. So burning corn is insulting to our southern neighbors- MX, HA, and not just a part of chicken feed.

Who is the Oil Industry executive? Sounds like a straw man.
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Banjoe
Champion Author Winnipeg

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Message Posted: Mar 16, 2014 7:53:42 AM

I'm looking forward to more of your real-world feedback. Happy driving!
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Hannie59
All-Star Author Appleton

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Message Posted: Mar 11, 2014 7:47:30 AM

Will do Banjoe... I am taking a new turn on the 2006 Elantra. Going to put a $200 conversion kit and run E-85 straight for the rest of the life of the vehicle. Instinct tells me that will be a good long time...
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wesley08
Veteran Author Atlanta

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Message Posted: Mar 9, 2014 8:18:42 PM

It wrecks marine engines
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RS101
Champion Author Minnesota

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Message Posted: Mar 9, 2014 9:14:25 AM

Interesting
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Banjoe
Champion Author Winnipeg

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Message Posted: Mar 9, 2014 8:37:46 AM

Thanks for the feedback Hannie59. This is fascinating stuff, especially in light of all the disasters being claimed all around us.

I'm not sure where all the pushback stems from, but your experiences are certainly worth a lot more than the entire collection of Chicken Little warnings. Please keep up the great experiment and let us know how things are working out.
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goldseeker
Champion Author West Virginia

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Message Posted: Mar 6, 2014 3:38:02 AM

If we had hydrous ethanol you would see prices down around $2.00 per gallon.
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Hannie59
All-Star Author Appleton

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Message Posted: Mar 5, 2014 3:22:23 PM

Good point Kruilty. Hydrous is great in ethanol engines. I think flex fuel requires anhydrous though, correct? But you are right about the savings and efficiencies of hydrous.

[Edited by: Hannie59 at 3/5/2014 3:22:46 PM EST]
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Kruilty
Sophomore Author Washington

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Message Posted: Mar 4, 2014 2:06:53 AM

Tests conducted in Europe have shown that the use of hydrous ethanol, which eliminates the need for the hydrous-to-anhydrous dehydration processing step, could mean energy savings of between ten percent and forty-five percent during processing, a four percent product volume increase, higher mileage per gallon, a cleaner engine interior and a reduction in greenhouse gas emissions.
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goldseeker
Champion Author West Virginia

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Message Posted: Mar 4, 2014 12:31:19 AM

I have been using ethanol for over 15 years in everything with no problems.

I need no gasline anti-freeze and have never changed my spark plugs.
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Hannie59
All-Star Author Appleton

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Message Posted: Mar 3, 2014 9:37:35 AM

Thanks for the question Banjoe.

I am an average driver. I did do my testing to prove that no damage can be done by ethanol, and that was my main goal.

However, since my base was 20% to 30% when I started this experiment, I can give information on mileage going up from there. Lately I have been going as high as 55%. I do lose mileage over my base of 20-30 in both cars. It's about 8% in the city with E55 loss from E-30. Only about 5% on the highway. I also believe that 30% is the barrier at which mileage loss accelerates, not 10%. Many have told me their mileage on E-30 was almost the same as E-10. Based on my two 1995 GMs I was running E 20 in some many years ago, I would concur.

So, when you push up the blend to 55% like me, you will lose some MPG. That number is highly exaggerated in the gasbuddy realm. But right now, my E-10 is 3.49 and I can get E-85 for 2.78, so my cost per mile is slightly better pushing the ethanol to higher concentrations. And as I have said, the ethanol has done no harm at all. I feel it has kept them running great. I realize with some cars, pushing it to 50% could trigger a check engine light, so I don't recommend THAT. Even if this happens it's the emission system saying, "WOW THESE EMISSIONS ARE NOT SUPPOSED TO BE THIS CLEAN SO SOMETHING MUST BE WRONG" No harm is occurring to the vehicle, but the light would make someone uneasy. I have seen a check engine light once when I ran pure E-85 in the 2009 :) And only once. As I said. Just do a couple gallons at a fill up you'll be glad you did. Now if you have been running E-0, your tank and lines are filthy. The fuel filter getting clogged as ethanol is introduced is not engine damage, that's a maintenance item that once you run ethanol, it will remain cleaner much longer too.

I truly feel Banjoe that individuals whom still believe ethyl alcohol is harmful to engines when the far more corrosive gasoline is not, truly believe the loudest voice they hear and cannot rationally think. 95% of the small engine mechanics are sold, from salesman, and subsequently preach a bill of goods.

Performance - no difference noticed. Acceleration is great on on ramps, interstates, and passing on 2-laners :)



[Edited by: Hannie59 at 3/3/2014 9:46:07 AM EST]
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Floridaman2013
Champion Author Florida

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Message Posted: Mar 3, 2014 8:21:47 AM

We have run ethanol in all different vehicles since it's inception, in lawn mowers, snow blowers, 2/4 stroke trimmers,2/4 stroke boat engines, and never a problem! This has been a big smear campaign as you say. I think that using ethanol actually burns cleaner than straight gasoline. And since using ethanol, We have not needed to use gas line anti-freeze for winter.
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Banjoe
Champion Author Winnipeg

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Message Posted: Mar 3, 2014 8:14:37 AM

Hannie59 - thanks for running these tests at your own peril. You were exploring without a map and while the crowd was telling you that there were only monsters waiting out there for you. Intelligent exploration, unquestionably.

Now, being a science based person, you must have tracked performance/efficiency along the way. There are all sorts of random reports out there on vehicle performance at ranges of mixtures but they seem to involve redialing the engine computer to optimize things at each change. The average, or even above average, driver isn't going to do any of that tuner stuff so there's no value in those reports for most of us. How did the various blends perform for you?
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SilverStreaker
Champion Author Twin Cities

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Message Posted: Mar 1, 2014 4:39:57 PM

I did the same over 4 years ago and have not seen any problems due to ethanol.
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