Not Logged In Log In   Sign Up   Points Leaders
Follow Us    4:18 PM

Message Forum - Read Message

Category: All Things Ethanol > Topics Add to favorite topics   Post new topicPost New Topic
Author Topic: Ethanol Fuel Tax Back to Topics
Steveo763

Veteran Author
Twin Cities

Posts:306
Points:105,665
Joined:Jul 2013
Message Posted: Aug 14, 2013 2:15:06 PM

I was just wondering, is E85 taxed? If so, is it the same tax as regular gasoline, or is there a pro-rated amount based off something else? Nonetheless, if it has its own unique tax, where can I find that info?
REPLIES (newest first) Post a Reply
Profile Pic
SoylentGrain
Champion Author Illinois

Posts:1,135
Points:20,700
Joined:Nov 2012
Message Posted: Sep 1, 2013 1:18:38 PM

"However, the tax breaks and goverment money used to build the plant to meke the fuel is larger than the cost of construction of the plant."

Do you have any proof of this?
Profile Pic
ugly46
Champion Author Indiana

Posts:2,665
Points:705,150
Joined:Jan 2012
Message Posted: Sep 1, 2013 10:16:42 AM

However, the tax breaks and goverment money used to build the plant to meke the fuel is larger than the cost of construction of the plant.
They make a profit even if they never make a gallon of fuel....

Let them make a profit on there money rather than mine....
Profile Pic
SoylentGrain
Champion Author Illinois

Posts:1,135
Points:20,700
Joined:Nov 2012
Message Posted: Aug 28, 2013 8:53:05 AM

"Forget the tax, just look at how much more you pay for food since all the corn crop goes to make fuel"

You consume too much propaganda. Ten years ago US farmers produced 10 to 11 billion bushels of corn annually. Today it's 13 to 14 billion bushes per year. That's a 30 to 40% increase. The number tossed around is "40% of the US corn crop goes to ethanol, blah blah blah." In reality, that 40% is processed into both food and ethanol.

So, what you have when you account for the animal feed produced by ethanol producers is less than 20% of current corn production is made into ethanol. Considering corn growers have increased production by 30% and we still have a surplus of corn. More food is available today than 10 years ago.

[Edited by: SoylentGrain at 8/28/2013 8:56:35 AM EST]
Profile Pic
krzysiek_ck
Champion Author Illinois

Posts:8,177
Points:1,302,185
Joined:Apr 2011
Message Posted: Aug 28, 2013 8:24:59 AM

dassfg wrote: "Forget the tax, just look at how much more you pay for food since all the corn crop goes to make fuel"

How much more exactly? How much more you pay because of the increased transportation cost?

[Edited by: krzysiek_ck at 8/28/2013 8:27:36 AM EST]
Profile Pic
dassfg
Champion Author Fort Worth

Posts:2,276
Points:1,044,720
Joined:Mar 2011
Message Posted: Aug 28, 2013 8:23:51 AM

Forget the tax, just look at how much more you pay for food since all the corn crop goes to make fuel
Profile Pic
Shockjock1961
Champion Author Illinois

Posts:23,572
Points:2,756,615
Joined:Apr 2006
Message Posted: Aug 24, 2013 8:08:49 AM

"In the state of Illinois as long as the blend is over 70% ethanol there are no state fuel taxes charged. So technically e-85 in the state should have an almost $2.00 a gallon advantage over e-10 gasoline if all the discounts are out on the table."

And despite that E85 in my area (well the one place that sells it) sells for $3.35/gal while RUG sells for $3.53/gal. Illinois provides numerous handouts for ethanol despite the fact that the state is, for all practical purposes bankrupt. Stupid is as stupid does...
Profile Pic
WhiskeyBurner
Veteran Author Illinois

Posts:450
Points:15,855
Joined:May 2013
Message Posted: Aug 21, 2013 11:54:36 PM

I believe we still pay the fuel tax at the pump, but you can get a rebate the first couple years you own the flex fuel vehicle or after you convert using a state approved conversion kit. With the spreads having been north of 30% for a while now, I'm not complaining one bit, even if I have to drive a little to get it. From what I've seen, that rebate might be enough to make an additional payment per year on my 200.
Profile Pic
brerrabbitTX
Champion Author Houston

Posts:1,396
Points:24,765
Joined:Mar 2011
Message Posted: Aug 21, 2013 9:50:58 PM

"Federal excise tax is the same for ethanol and gasoline. Some states have some differences between regular and ethanol, but it's not much. pennies per gallon."

In Illinois it is pennies per gallon, actually 19 pennies per gallon. Add that to price differential of gas and ethanol and add back in the RIN credit value and e-85 is a lot cheaper and should be selling pretty well given the price advantage.
Profile Pic
brerrabbitTX
Champion Author Houston

Posts:1,396
Points:24,765
Joined:Mar 2011
Message Posted: Aug 21, 2013 9:46:50 PM

In the state of Illinois as long as the blend is over 70% ethanol there are no state fuel taxes charged. So technically e-85 in the state should have an almost $2.00 a gallon advantage over e-10 gasoline if all the discounts are out on the table.
Profile Pic
cools1611
Champion Author Providence

Posts:1,164
Points:399,440
Joined:Jun 2012
Message Posted: Aug 18, 2013 7:33:36 PM

Tax on everything
Profile Pic
SoylentGrain
Champion Author Illinois

Posts:1,135
Points:20,700
Joined:Nov 2012
Message Posted: Aug 18, 2013 5:39:01 PM

Federal excise tax is the same for ethanol and gasoline. Some states have some differences between regular and ethanol, but it's not much. pennies per gallon.

Profile Pic
smugutu1234
Champion Author Tallahassee

Posts:2,220
Points:526,145
Joined:Feb 2013
Message Posted: Aug 18, 2013 12:30:48 PM

More taxes.
Profile Pic
aRBy
All-Star Author Grand Rapids

Posts:589
Points:356,290
Joined:May 2005
Message Posted: Aug 17, 2013 11:29:12 PM

Yes. E85 is taxed.

There were some tax incentives, but they have all been lifted for a long time now.
Profile Pic
E-Squirrel
Champion Author Orange County

Posts:3,371
Points:950,230
Joined:Feb 2005
Message Posted: Aug 17, 2013 7:11:50 PM

Original poster, Steveo763:

"I was just wondering, is E85 taxed? If so, is it the same tax as regular gasoline, or is there a pro-rated amount based off something else?"

Yes, its taxed, and the particulars of how its taxed vary by state and even county. Here in southern California where I live, there are multiple taxes, resulting in more than 25% of the pump price. At least one of these is based upon using ethanol as a fuel. At present, this tax is $0.09 per gallon (of ethanol). This means that the actual tax (on the 85% ethanol) is a bit over seven and a half cents per gallon of E85, while on E10, it is a bit less than a tenth of a cent.

[Edited by: E-Squirrel at 8/17/2013 7:13:22 PM EST]
Profile Pic
E-Squirrel
Champion Author Orange County

Posts:3,371
Points:950,230
Joined:Feb 2005
Message Posted: Aug 17, 2013 7:05:44 PM

BigHorne1 proposes:

"Get rid of ethanol altogether, then see if prices at the pump go under two dollars a gallon..."

No, it won't. If you think so, you don't really understand where the money goes for a gallon of fuel. At todays global petroleum prices, just the crude oil used to make gasoline is more than $2.00 per gallon. There is no way to ever get the price of gasoline back under $2.00 per gallon without cutting the price of the oil by at least half.

Cost Analysis of a Gallon of E10
Profile Pic
SilverStreaker
Champion Author Twin Cities

Posts:14,067
Points:2,768,020
Joined:Mar 2006
Message Posted: Aug 17, 2013 4:33:01 PM

Brilliant, get rid of petroleum's competition, then see if petroleum goes down? Another genius idea!
Profile Pic
BigHorne1
Champion Author Missouri

Posts:3,673
Points:815,680
Joined:Jul 2012
Message Posted: Aug 17, 2013 2:57:30 PM

Get rid of ethanol altogether, then see if prices at the pump go under two dollars a gallon and food prices go lower.

If not, have a major investigations in the big oil, gas, and utility companies and farmers, sinc they say is the problem to expensive prices.
Profile Pic
smugutu1234
Champion Author Tallahassee

Posts:2,220
Points:526,145
Joined:Feb 2013
Message Posted: Aug 17, 2013 10:47:43 AM

What isn't taxed?
Profile Pic
Steveo763
Veteran Author Twin Cities

Posts:306
Points:105,665
Joined:Jul 2013
Message Posted: Aug 16, 2013 6:41:59 PM

Borsht,

If you think the Fuel Tax was created to tax a fuel's energy abilities, you need to pass me whatever it is that you are smoking. It is simply a consumption tax, and if mileage goes down, you consume more, and it has an equivalent fuel tax on it, that would mean E85 users pay MORE fuel taxes than yourself given the same make and model vehicle. However, with the price difference of Ethanol, our cost per mile is still less than E10.

The difference is that our vehicles are greener, pollute less, and our cost per mile is cheaper even though we pay more fuel taxes than yourself... Not to mention you're helping our trade deficit, since most of our oil comes from Canada or outside of North America. I don't mind crude coming from Canada, but with ethanol I can consume a fuel that was grown in MN, transported in MN, Brewed in MN, transported again in MN, and finally consumed in Minnesota. It's simple Micro Economics, if you can keep your dollars circulating within a smaller area, it will generate more economic productivity since it exchanges hands that many times all in USA, and, if you live in the corn belt, in the same state.
Profile Pic
Hannie59
All-Star Author Appleton

Posts:964
Points:24,300
Joined:Apr 2010
Message Posted: Aug 16, 2013 3:51:08 PM

Yeah right borsht... gasoline should never be used as a benchmark for anything else.

[Edited by: Hannie59 at 8/16/2013 3:53:01 PM EST]
Profile Pic
borsht
Champion Author Oakland

Posts:3,186
Points:754,945
Joined:Aug 2012
Message Posted: Aug 16, 2013 3:44:37 PM

It should be taxed at its gasoline energy equivalency GEG, gasoline equivalency gallon.
Profile Pic
cools1611
Champion Author Providence

Posts:1,164
Points:399,440
Joined:Jun 2012
Message Posted: Aug 16, 2013 3:36:40 PM

It is Taxed in every state I have been to till date, Makes me feel like it's taxed in every state.



[Edited by: cools1611 at 8/16/2013 3:38:23 PM EST]
Profile Pic
tdioiler
All-Star Author Detroit

Posts:995
Points:705,025
Joined:Jul 2011
Message Posted: Aug 15, 2013 10:30:09 PM

But the production has been given tax breaks to get the market started. Now the only thing holding the line on lower production levels are the RPS mandates made up by people in the town without brains. You know, the one's we vote for!?!?
Profile Pic
WhiskeyBurner
Veteran Author Illinois

Posts:450
Points:15,855
Joined:May 2013
Message Posted: Aug 15, 2013 1:29:03 AM

I think we are taxed the same way here in Illinois for both gas and E85, but Illinois does do a tax rebate for the first year or two of E85 use in flex fuel vehicles and I thought so in non flex fuelers with approved conversions too.
Profile Pic
ZR1S10
Rookie Author Chicago

Posts:71
Points:4,485
Joined:Jul 2013
Message Posted: Aug 14, 2013 6:43:00 PM

Yes E85 is taxed. It varies from state-to-state but in most places it has the same tax-rate as gas.
Post a reply Back to Topics