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Author Topic: What Happens When the Oil Runs Out Back to Topics
gamechanger2011

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Message Posted: Jul 30, 2013 10:49:51 PM

Articles like this are what drive me to do what we are doing.

"Of greatest concern is how much oil is remaining. As noted, we currently use 30 billion barrels a year – 84 million barrels a day, or a thousand barrels every second. When it is trumpeted about some new and huge find of oil, e.g. the Tupi field off Brazil, thought to contain 8 billion barrels, in reality this is only enough to run the world for three months. Context should not be lost in these matters. The quality of the oil is also at issue. For example, much of the remaining oil is of the “heavy”, “sour” kind, meaning that it is not necessarily liquid at all, but bitumen, and contains relatively high levels of sulphur, necessitating complex and energy-intensive processing to get the sulphur out – which would otherwise be corrosive toward the steel used in the refinery – and to crack the heavier material into lighter fractions that can be used as fuel, or as feedstocks for industry."
What Happens When the Oil Runs Out
REPLIES (newest first) Post a Reply
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aRBy
All-Star Author Grand Rapids

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Message Posted: Nov 6, 2013 11:08:48 PM

When the oil runs out, the tyrannies that make up OPEC will implode. What ultimately comes of that is anyone's guess.
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borsht
Champion Author Oakland

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Message Posted: Nov 6, 2013 3:07:31 PM

There is lots of fision fuel out there, and it doesn't produce CO2.
There is unbcredible amount of energy available thru nuclear fusion.
There is a lot of coal than can be converted to gasoline.
We've got so much natural gas they have already flared over $1Billion worth in North Dakota.
If is wasn't all these artificial supply controls, gasoline would less than half of the current price before tax.
So we are screwed for getting cheap gasoline, but the supply is not going to run out for many generations.
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Chazzer
Champion Author Nevada

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Message Posted: Nov 6, 2013 2:31:11 PM

Fuel made from coal and other synthetic fuels!
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WilhamClouse
Champion Author Calgary

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Message Posted: Nov 2, 2013 11:14:35 AM

Oil may run out someday, but their is still plenty for many years to come.
Lots of time for proper alternatives to be developed.
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pt1KY
Champion Author Lexington

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Message Posted: Nov 1, 2013 11:42:56 AM

Really!!!!
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darwinfinch
Veteran Author Gasbuddy

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Message Posted: Nov 1, 2013 10:16:05 AM

"oil run out? I don't think so, just part of the grand deception to keep prices high "

Something weird:

An obviously finite resource (oil) becomes harder to find. People react by saying that it's a conspiracy and that we'll never run out.

An obviously renewable resource (corn) increases measurably in supply. People react by saying that we don't have enough and we're running out.

:: I'm confused. ::
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SilverStreaker
Champion Author Twin Cities

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Message Posted: Nov 1, 2013 10:05:57 AM

"I don't think so, just part of the grand deception to keep prices high"
Sure, that's just a part of the intergalactic conspiracy.
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Boyrr
Champion Author Allentown

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Message Posted: Nov 1, 2013 6:59:33 AM

oil run out? I don't think so, just part of the grand deception to keep prices high
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darwinfinch
Veteran Author Gasbuddy

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Message Posted: Oct 31, 2013 10:56:02 AM

"If we don't use the oil then what good is it?"

How far would you go to get it? How much would you pay to use it, even if cheaper alternatives exist?

How much of it would you burn, knowing that it's polluting your neighborhood and your lungs, even when a cleaner/safer alternative is available?

Landfills are full of old tires and plastics. Should we burn that too? I mean, if we don't... what good are they?
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GrumpyCat
Champion Author Alabama

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Message Posted: Oct 30, 2013 5:25:36 PM

So what if we run out of oil? Then all you alcoholics will be in ethanol-heaven.

If we don't use the oil then what good is it?
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aRBy
All-Star Author Grand Rapids

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Message Posted: Oct 30, 2013 1:16:26 AM

We're either going to run out or the demand will grow beyond what can be supplied by petroleum alone.
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darwinfinch
Veteran Author Gasbuddy

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Message Posted: Oct 29, 2013 2:31:31 PM

Even Iran and Saudi Arabia are developing new agricultural zones to explore biofuel technology, as their well numbers plummet.
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darwinfinch
Veteran Author Gasbuddy

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Message Posted: Oct 29, 2013 2:25:35 PM

Sorry, but the "we will never run out" viewpoint is a very wishful, uneducated, and dangerous point of view to have. The fact that they have resorted to squeezing oil out of tar sands now (300% increase in last 6 years) should tell you something.
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GrumpyCat
Champion Author Alabama

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Message Posted: Oct 29, 2013 2:05:26 PM

Blah blah blah.

When "oil runs out" we won't have diesel and natural gas to make ethanol out of, will we?
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rumbleseat
Champion Author Winnipeg

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Message Posted: Oct 29, 2013 6:21:24 AM

"we will never run out"

Yeah, right, it may become scarce and very expensive some day, so only billionaires will be able to afford it, but we will never run out, and it is our grandchildren that won't be able to afford it, not us. So, who cares, right?
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pghbill
Champion Author Pittsburgh

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Message Posted: Oct 29, 2013 12:16:54 AM

we will never run out
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HotRod10
Champion Author Wyoming

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Message Posted: Oct 8, 2013 12:55:01 PM

Yep, the CAFE standards do nothing but make cars more expensive to feed the federal coffers, and it's going to get worse, unless the Senate passes the repeal passed by the House and POTUS doesn't veto it.

[Edited by: HotRod10 at 10/8/2013 12:57:25 PM EST]
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SoylentGrain
Champion Author Illinois

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Message Posted: Oct 8, 2013 11:37:58 AM

"The limitation on the credit based on usage that you mentioned is scheduled to go into effect for MY2015 and beyond. "

Which means greater expense for the carmakers. That's an overhead expense spread across all product lines. Again, what that means to you is no matter what type of car you buy, it's going to cost more.
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HotRod10
Champion Author Wyoming

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Message Posted: Oct 8, 2013 10:30:55 AM

"Actually, it doesn't; you misunderstand how the CAFE standard is applied. In order to "qualify" for a reduction, the manufacture must demonstrate how much ethanol is ACTUALLY BURNED by consumers of those vehicles on the road."

Currently, they get the credit for FFVs regardless of whether E85 is actually used or not. The limitation on the credit based on usage that you mentioned is scheduled to go into effect for MY2015 and beyond.
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SoylentGrain
Champion Author Illinois

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Message Posted: Oct 7, 2013 10:09:00 PM

I know exactly how they are applied, squirrel. I was talking in financial terms. Read what I wrote a little closer.
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E-Squirrel
Champion Author Orange County

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Message Posted: Oct 7, 2013 9:06:11 PM

SoylentGrain avers:

"As far as not being included in CAFE requirements, by producing cars with higher mileage ratings, the company pays less overall tax."

Actually, it doesn't; you misunderstand how the CAFE standard is applied. In order to "qualify" for a reduction, the manufacture must demonstrate how much ethanol is ACTUALLY BURNED by consumers of those vehicles on the road. In a state like mine, where E85 is generally unavailable, very little is actually burned in FFV vehicles, so there are few if any savings to anybody. Of course, additional costs to cover this feature is still charged to the customer, so he is essentially paying extra for a relatively "unusable" feature when he buys one of these.

If you have wondered by so few FFV are actually on the road, this will help you to understand. CAFE standards are grossly ineffective compared with fuel taxes at increasing the general mileage of the national fleet, probably because there are so many exceptions and "allowances" built into this law. You can find a comprehensive discussion of the topic here:

Forbes on the US CAFE system
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TomB2
Champion Author St. Louis

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Message Posted: Oct 6, 2013 3:35:04 PM

Ask again in 50 to 75 years.
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borsht
Champion Author Oakland

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Message Posted: Oct 5, 2013 7:30:40 PM

some suggest that this may coincide with hell freezing over.
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Shockjock1961
Champion Author Illinois

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Message Posted: Oct 5, 2013 3:47:15 PM

"My guess is that by that time, scientists and engineers will have figured out how to get fuel from hydrogen and/or water (which is 2 parts Hydrogen)"

And the dumbing down of America continues. If you go and take a basic High School physics course you will learn that it takes far more energy to split water into it's components of hydrogen and oxygen then you get back when you recombine them....
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SoylentGrain
Champion Author Illinois

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Message Posted: Oct 5, 2013 12:28:06 PM

" My guess is that by that time, scientists and engineers will have figured out how to get fuel from hydrogen and/or water (which is 2 parts Hydrogen). "

That's been known for about a century, now. The issue is that water is a byproduct of burning hydrogen. So, to unburn something that is already oxidized, it takes a lot of energy. Where does that energy come from?
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Primetime57
Champion Author Long Island

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Message Posted: Oct 5, 2013 11:26:59 AM

"What happens when oil runs out"? you ask? My guess is that by that time, scientists and engineers will have figured out how to get fuel from hydrogen and/or water (which is 2 parts Hydrogen).
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SoylentGrain
Champion Author Illinois

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Message Posted: Oct 4, 2013 12:59:50 PM

"So it doesn't bother you that the car makers are using your precious E85 as a decoy to get around the CAFE standards?"

Who on earth told you that moronic reason car manufacturers produce FFVs. And no it doesn't bother me that a US company pays less tax, fines, fees, or whatever label you want to place on US companies writing checks to the government.
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HotRod10
Champion Author Wyoming

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Message Posted: Oct 4, 2013 11:50:29 AM

"So what. The car maker then pays less in "fines". That increases profitablilty and give the company room to lower prices on all cars it manufactures, even the small ones."

So it doesn't bother you that the car makers are using your precious E85 as a decoy to get around the CAFE standards? You just want them to make more FFVs, even if it's a sham; very principled of you.
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HotRod10
Champion Author Wyoming

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Message Posted: Oct 4, 2013 11:45:01 AM

"Also, we drive using E85 and we can not detect a difference in fuel economy."

Just because you can't detect it isn't really convincing to me, SoylentGrain; I refer back to an earlier post of yours:

"I don't see a measurable difference. I've driven over 130,000 miles with E85 and several hundred thousand miles with E10. It's difficult to measure a difference with E85 when I drive an identical route, under similar weather and driving conditions. I might see a 5% difference with E85. It's just plain too close to measure."

If you can't track your mileage any closer than plus or minus 5% (if it's actually even that close), then your assurances that E85 doesn't affect your mileage are very suspect, particularly when your bias is so obvious.
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SoylentGrain
Champion Author Illinois

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Message Posted: Oct 4, 2013 11:01:06 AM

"First, it's not a tax, it's a fine."

The entertainment value of your responses is priceless.

"Second, the point is that the company gets to claim some ridiculously high "gas mileage" rating for a vehicle that, in most cases, will use 3 times the gasoline of a car like mine, because almost no one uses E85, even in FFVs."

So what. The car maker then pays less in "fines". That increases profitablilty and give the company room to lower prices on all cars it manufactures, even the small ones.

Also, we drive using E85 and we can not detect a difference in fuel economy.
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HotRod10
Champion Author Wyoming

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Message Posted: Oct 4, 2013 9:59:18 AM

"Perhaps, that is because, ethanol is not gasoline, not a crude oil product, and is renewable. As far as not being included in CAFE requirements, by producing cars with higher mileage ratings, the company pays less overall tax. If the company pays less tax, you pay less for your car, regardless of if it's an ffv or not."

First, it's not a tax, it's a fine.

Second, the point is that the company gets to claim some ridiculously high "gas mileage" rating for a vehicle that, in most cases, will use 3 times the gasoline of a car like mine, because almost no one uses E85, even in FFVs. I have a friend with a full-size SUV FFV, and they have quit using E85 because the lower cost does not offset the poorer mileage and it costs more to run E85.

The CAFE standards don't improve mileage anyway, they just jack up the price of all cars and give the politicians more money to waste and more power to manipulate the economy.
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ggg452
Champion Author Manitoba

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Message Posted: Oct 4, 2013 9:41:14 AM

When oil runs out, my great, great, great, great ,great, great grandchildren will be dead and we will have already discovered plenty of energy on the moon, pluto, Jupiter, and planet X where half of the world's over-population have moved because of the lush vegetation including 900 pound tomatoes and 16 foot long cucumbers... hows that?
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Steveo763
Veteran Author Twin Cities

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Message Posted: Oct 4, 2013 9:20:38 AM

Nukes, and atmospheric fixation of things like methanol. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uK367T7h6ZY

Probably will happen once the greenies realize nukes are the only way to go carbon-neutral/free, and of course the general public realizing nukes really aren't that dangerous as long as you don't blatantly disregard multiple recommendations that your system is unsafe.
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SoylentGrain
Champion Author Illinois

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Message Posted: Oct 4, 2013 7:28:45 AM

" FFV exist only so that the manufacturers can claim a higher "gas mileage" for the vehicle model, since only the 15% gasoline of E85 is counted in this measure."

Perhaps, that is because, ethanol is not gasoline, not a crude oil product, and is renewable. As far as not being included in CAFE requirements, by producing cars with higher mileage ratings, the company pays less overall tax. If the company pays less tax, you pay less for your car, regardless of if it's an ffv or not.

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E-Squirrel
Champion Author Orange County

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Message Posted: Oct 3, 2013 6:25:08 PM

Floridaman2013 complains:

"Every vehicle should be FFV, again the Manufacturers are just cheap or people care more about high power stereos with big amps and other fancy doo-dads instead of a better fuel efficient vehicle."

Actually few models are made because they are not particularly popular with consumers who don't see an advantage to paying extra for this feature. FFV exist only so that the manufacturers can claim a higher "gas mileage" for the vehicle model, since only the 15% gasoline of E85 is counted in this measure.

Check the mileage figures. The most fuel efficient vehicles on the road today are NOT FFV.

[Edited by: E-Squirrel at 10/3/2013 6:27:01 PM EST]
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darwinfinch
Veteran Author Gasbuddy

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Message Posted: Oct 1, 2013 4:23:18 PM

The question shouldn't be "when the oil runs out" but rather "when we decide that extracting oil is too expensive and unhealthy".
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Wanda127
Champion Author Florida

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Message Posted: Sep 28, 2013 9:42:31 PM

I don't think we need to worry about that. The world as we know it will be gone before it runs out of oil.
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matbas
Veteran Author Dallas

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Message Posted: Sep 27, 2013 8:02:57 PM

when we run out of oil, we will go out and buy some more.
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hoosh13
Champion Author Vancouver

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Message Posted: Sep 27, 2013 7:21:40 PM

Your engine could seize up
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buddyro1
Champion Author Georgia

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Message Posted: Sep 27, 2013 4:04:05 AM

None of us here will ever see it run out, and if Obama would stop his destruction of America, we still have coal that has become cleaner in the last years.
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minookaband
Champion Author Illinois

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Message Posted: Sep 26, 2013 11:58:11 PM

will not happen anytime soon.
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Chazzer
Champion Author Nevada

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Message Posted: Sep 25, 2013 2:32:51 PM

We develop a new synthetic fuel!
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aRBy
All-Star Author Grand Rapids

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Message Posted: Sep 9, 2013 10:11:00 PM

When petroleum runs out, we'll use something else for fuel.

Ask a simple question; I yield a simple answer.
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waynefun
Rookie Author Twin Cities

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Message Posted: Sep 9, 2013 8:27:19 PM

You bring up a topic that is not not an easy answer right now 2013 but who is to say in 100 years only time will tell.
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gamechanger2011
Champion Author Wichita

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Message Posted: Sep 9, 2013 12:22:45 PM

Florida2013 "Every vehicle should be FFV" Agreed! if every vehicle was FFV we would all have choices at the pump. It costs very little to do this at the factory. I think it's close to 10,000,000 or more. Somebody could probably give a closer number then I have.
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borsht
Champion Author Oakland

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Message Posted: Sep 9, 2013 11:49:56 AM

When oil runs out, it can be made from coal. Almost half the known coal reserves are in the U.S.
Also, coal and nuclear can generate the electricity for our electric cars.

Any conspiracy theorist here that think that big oil is pushing that green stuff is good the black stuff, coal is bad.

[Edited by: borsht at 9/9/2013 11:51:07 AM EST]
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CORNHICK
All-Star Author Omaha

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Message Posted: Sep 8, 2013 9:03:39 PM

when the oil runs out I think we will have the electric cars just as good as the gas ones or better
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borsht
Champion Author Oakland

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Message Posted: Sep 8, 2013 8:27:39 PM

Then we may need to use ethanol.
But in reality, it will be impossible to produce ethanol at the rate we're using petroleum.
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Floridaman2013
Champion Author Atlanta

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Message Posted: Sep 8, 2013 7:08:14 AM

Does anyone really know the percentage of cars and trucks that are FFV today, because every time I go shopping for a new vehicle, I only see one or 2 models in a manufacturers line and sometimes not in what we are looking for, especially SUV/trucks. Every vehicle should be FFV, again the Manufacturers are just cheap or people care more about high power stereos with big amps and other fancy doo-dads instead of a better fuel efficient vehicle.
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33gort33
Champion Author Indiana

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Message Posted: Sep 7, 2013 7:11:28 AM

it won't run out - not unless you live to be 300- 400 yrs old
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