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Author Topic: Who has done this test? Back to Topics
movinup2013

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Arkansas

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Message Posted: May 24, 2013 12:03:38 AM

How much does your MPG increase when you don't use ethanol?

[Edited by: movinup2013 at 5/24/2013 12:07:05 AM EST]
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33gort33
Champion Author Indiana

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Message Posted: Jul 26, 2013 8:37:31 AM

same...no diff
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pburt1959
Rookie Author Georgia

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Message Posted: Jul 23, 2013 2:53:55 PM

4Mpg 2000 Ford Ranger 4.0L V6
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tropicalmn
Veteran Author Minnesota

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Message Posted: Jul 23, 2013 9:25:16 AM

"Typical... A red herring thrown out to divert the conversation away from the original point that point being that ethanol both raises food prices and reduces the amount of arable land that can be used to raise food crops..."


Typical...the hypocrite is accusing another of a red herring. The topic is "How much does your MPG increase when you don't use ethanol?" not third world countries....
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Shockjock1961
Champion Author Illinois

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Message Posted: Jul 23, 2013 8:11:34 AM

"They should probably consider contraception then"

Typical... A red herring thrown out to divert the conversation away from the original point that point being that ethanol both raises food prices and reduces the amount of arable land that can be used to raise food crops...

It statement demonstrates a complete lack of knowledge concerning the situation faced by those in the third world as well as a complete lack of compassion...



[Edited by: Shockjock1961 at 7/23/2013 8:15:06 AM EST]
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duybn
Champion Author Connecticut

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Message Posted: Jul 23, 2013 12:11:41 AM

wish I can..
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WhiskeyBurner
Veteran Author Illinois

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Message Posted: Jul 20, 2013 2:56:47 AM

Both of mine do too.
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krzysiek_ck
Champion Author Illinois

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Message Posted: Jul 19, 2013 9:00:57 AM

smugutu1234 wrote: "Ethanol is bad for your car."

My cars disagree with you.
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FrankLee1
All-Star Author Minnesota

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Message Posted: Jul 19, 2013 7:41:54 AM

Gasoline is bad for your garden.
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smugutu1234
Champion Author Tallahassee

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Message Posted: Jul 19, 2013 7:13:22 AM

Ethanol is bad for your car.
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FrankLee1
All-Star Author Minnesota

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Message Posted: Jul 19, 2013 12:57:17 AM

They should probably consider contraception then.
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MikeCapeCoral
Champion Author Cape Coral

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Message Posted: Jul 19, 2013 12:37:45 AM

I have not seen a big difference when I pay the piper and buy a tank-full of R90.
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Shockjock1961
Champion Author Illinois

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Message Posted: Jul 18, 2013 5:31:35 PM

Not me personally, but 820 million people throughout the world are...
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FrankLee1
All-Star Author Minnesota

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Message Posted: Jul 18, 2013 1:21:22 PM

Are you starving?
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pt1KY
Champion Author Lexington

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Message Posted: Jul 18, 2013 10:23:57 AM

You can't eat ethanol!
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FrankLee1
All-Star Author Minnesota

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Message Posted: Jul 17, 2013 1:26:53 PM

What test? You haven't established any conditions that would make for a meaningful result. :/
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dassfg
Champion Author Fort Worth

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Message Posted: Jul 17, 2013 12:05:32 PM

several yeas ago (last opportunity) it was 2 - 5 mpg
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33gort33
Champion Author Indiana

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Message Posted: Jul 17, 2013 11:22:29 AM

no difference
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txmtnbiker74
Rookie Author Fort Worth

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Message Posted: Jul 16, 2013 5:05:39 PM

In my hemi about 1mpg difference, but in my 4 cylinder car & boat gets about 4-5mpg better running conventional oil. Not any change with synthetics at all 10-30w
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Chazzer
Champion Author Nevada

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Message Posted: Jul 15, 2013 2:21:00 PM

Just started the test. Did notice a drop of 2.0 MPG. I bought more gas and lower MPG. The test goes on!
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SoylentGrain
Champion Author Illinois

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Message Posted: Jul 15, 2013 6:18:02 AM

We have 115,000 miles on a 2002 Tahoe we purchased new. The majority of fuel used in this vehicle has been E85. On repeated routes, hundreds of times, we see no measurable difference between E85 and regular gasoline.
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FrankLee1
All-Star Author Minnesota

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Message Posted: Jul 12, 2013 1:58:32 PM

Same here; I have been running E85 straight and in blends with E10 for many years in NON-flex fuel cars (mainly '92 Tempo and '94 F150, among others) and can claim no issues and no mpg decrease under certain conditions. Up to about a 50/50 blend results in no discernable mpg decrease and no Check Engine Light; stronger blends will decrease mpgs BUT NOT on a btu basis as many like to claim, and stronger blends do sometimes trigger the CEL but that is only because the fuel mixture trim is maxed out- engine still runs fine. One other caveat is that strong E85 blends can result in hard starting in sub-freezing weather; I have found best results in altering my blends by season by using up to 100% E85 in the summer heat, down to only E10 in the -40deg F MN winter, and proportionally in between. An exception to that extreme cold rule is on a long road trip- with engine warm I can fill with straight E85 and get to destination with no issues but I will fill with E10 before shutdown so the next cold start is with a low ethanol strength blend. P.S. The F150 is great for that because with dual tanks I can fill one with E85 and the other with E10; in bitter cold I start on E10 then switch to E85 when warm.

[Edited by: FrankLee1 at 7/12/2013 2:02:33 PM EST]
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krzysiek_ck
Champion Author Illinois

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Message Posted: Jul 12, 2013 8:44:34 AM

tdioiler wrote: "But I would agree that E10 shouldn't be a problem for most (15 or less years old) vehicles. But higher E levels would be a bigger % of fleet problem as many older vehicles will start having issues."

I have 1994 that enjoys running on E35. I can report zero fuel related issues. What about you?
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tdioiler
Champion Author Detroit

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Message Posted: Jul 11, 2013 11:03:49 PM

So Rumbleseat, are you saying your MPG actually went up with using higher mixes of ethanol?

But I would agree that E10 shouldn't be a problem for most (15 or less years old) vehicles. But higher E levels would be a bigger % of fleet problem as many older vehicles will start having issues.

Wait until the fleet gets a little younger and higher E content can be handled. But mandating it is like forcing everyone to use Liptor. An hows that worked out for you blood-sugar level?
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darwinfinch
Veteran Author Gasbuddy

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Message Posted: Jul 8, 2013 5:20:33 PM

"Corn is for food..."

And water is for drinking but we don't shut down all the carwashes for that reason.
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ggg452
Champion Author Manitoba

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Message Posted: Jul 8, 2013 2:01:48 PM

Corn is for food...
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darwinfinch
Veteran Author Gasbuddy

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Message Posted: Jul 8, 2013 12:12:55 PM

Shockjock... I wonder if you could please post the station or general area you fueled up at so we can compare the prices?
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darwinfinch
Veteran Author Gasbuddy

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Message Posted: Jul 8, 2013 12:09:43 PM

If your gaskets and seals can't handle a 10-15% blend of ethanol then your car probably doesn't have passenger-side seat belts either.
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Shockjock1961
Champion Author Illinois

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Message Posted: Jul 8, 2013 12:04:16 PM

"I notice you didn't post the price comparison you had to pay to get your "fully fossil"

That's because where I was traveling the only fuel available was undiluted gasoline. It actually cost 50 cents less per gallon then the fuel back in Illinois....
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OceanArcher
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Message Posted: Jul 8, 2013 11:54:38 AM

I justify staying away from "E-type fuels" because the gaskets and seals in my car weren't designed for it.
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darwinfinch
Veteran Author Gasbuddy

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Message Posted: Jul 8, 2013 10:18:08 AM

Shockjock... I notice you didn't post the price comparison you had to pay to get your "fully fossil" premium gas. I'll try to estimate, because I suspect you didn't save any money.

I'm going to assume you drove to Wisconsin because that is a state near Illinois which does not (I believe) have an E10 mandate. Using the tools available, I looked for the price difference between E10 and E0 at Wisconsin stations, and AT BEST, E0 was 6% more expensive than E10. You claimed to get a 6.7% increase in fuel efficiency on E0. This means that if you were able to find the best-priced E0 in Wisconsin, you saved around 2 cents per gallon by filling up with E0, factoring in the mileage change in your (apparently ancient) vehicle. More likely, however, you did not find the ideal E0 price, and what you paid for "premium" E0 was 7-10% higher than the available E10 at the same stations, meaning you not only lost money, but also gave your dollars to Big Oil, which continues to pollute, become LESS efficient over time, and has no plan for the future of its finite resources, not to mention the impact on foreign relations.

I wonder how you can justify actively choosing E0 over the renewable homegrown alternative with anything other than an old fashioned, engrained preference for the status-quo?
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smugutu1234
Champion Author Tallahassee

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Message Posted: Jul 8, 2013 10:00:35 AM

5 to 10 mpg
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jacksfan
Champion Author Lincoln

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Message Posted: Jul 8, 2013 9:52:23 AM

Good for you, shocky. And we should believe you why?
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FrankLee1
All-Star Author Minnesota

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Message Posted: Jul 8, 2013 8:28:24 AM

I recently went on a road trip. I bought the same sort of gas (same ethanol content) each time. The milage varied from 38 to 42mpg. v OOPS. v
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Shockjock1961
Champion Author Illinois

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Message Posted: Jul 8, 2013 6:52:12 AM

I recently went on a road trip. Once I left Illinois I was able to buy gasoline that wasn't diluted with ethanol. My highway mileage went from 30mpg to 32mpg. The mileage stayed elevated through 3 tanks of gasoline, however when I was forced to buy e-10 again, I saw an instant drop back to levels I'm more accustomed to seeing...
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nurdco
Champion Author Colorado Springs

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Message Posted: Jul 8, 2013 12:06:08 AM

NO ETHANOL FREE gas in CO because of EPA
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goldseeker
Champion Author West Virginia

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Message Posted: Jul 5, 2013 2:53:21 AM

What a bogus claim.
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rumbleseat
Champion Author Winnipeg

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Message Posted: Jul 5, 2013 2:28:30 AM

Fuel-Testers lost me immediately with their definitive statement regarding lower gas mileage. They didn't test any car I owned, and I have NEVER experienced an actual decrease in mileage except when I drove out of province and ended up burning E0, a fuel my vehicle is not used to.
Plus the web page reinforces a lot of false information.
Bottom line, if I haven't experienced damage in a single vehicle since the introduction of E10 in my markets over 30 years ago, I am highly unlikely to ever experience it.
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SilverStreaker
Champion Author Twin Cities

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Message Posted: Jul 4, 2013 9:26:49 PM

Fuel testers wouldn't sell their product if they didn't post their rhetoric about ethanol.
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borsht
Champion Author Oakland

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Message Posted: Jul 4, 2013 9:00:42 PM

Fuel tester have done test and provide information on E10 usage.
http://www.fuel-testers.com/MPG_gas_efficiency_E10_ethanol.html
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williamcabot
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Message Posted: Jul 4, 2013 1:37:01 PM

Test
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goldseeker
Champion Author West Virginia

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Message Posted: Jun 2, 2013 6:28:13 AM

I have been using ethanol blends for nearly 30 years and have had no issues, and no significant reduction in mileage.
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krzysiek_ck
Champion Author Illinois

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Message Posted: Jun 1, 2013 8:16:11 PM

Armchair expert congratulating Big Oil Shill in his/her MPG findings. What a joke.
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reb4
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Message Posted: Jun 1, 2013 1:51:04 PM

RedRider1OK, thanks for posting your findings... kind counters the wild exaggerations from those that say they notice no difference in higher etanol content... But oh my the cries of "FOUL" from the ethanol advocates...

Of course I can't really offer doing this test since I do not normally drive outside of the area in my own car... And since the ethanol mandate is pushing non ethanol fuel out of existence...

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aRBy
All-Star Author Grand Rapids

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Message Posted: Jun 1, 2013 12:47:21 PM

My gas mileage decreases 15% when using E85 exclusively in my 2008 Flex Fuel Impala. A few gallons of E10 here and there makes a huge improvement.

Over time, when using E85 exclusively, gas mileage drops below 15%. When that happens, I typically run two tanks of E10. After that, the E85 gas mileage returns to a solid 15% decrease (sometimes better depending on how much E10 is left in the fuel tank).

The "rule of thumb" is generally correct. You get 85% of the MPG on E85 as you do on 87 Octane in a flex fuel vehicle. If the price of E85 is 85% of 87 Octane, the price is roughly equal. If the price of E85 is less than 85% of 87 Octane, it's a better deal. If the price of E85 is more than 85% of 87 Octane, you're buying 105 Octane fuel, so you can rationalize that you're still coming out ahead.
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33gort33
Champion Author Indiana

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Message Posted: May 29, 2013 8:59:32 AM

mine doesn't fluctuate like many that report here
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smugutu1234
Champion Author Tallahassee

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Message Posted: May 29, 2013 8:48:29 AM

A lot!
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krzysiek_ck
Champion Author Illinois

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Message Posted: May 28, 2013 8:28:18 AM

GrumpyCat wrote: "Efficiency of economy? MPG is economy, not efficiency. A common mistake by armchair ethanol apologists who only play with rhetoric and do not understand math, chemistry, or engineering.

I have never claimed ethanol was more or less efficient than gasoline. But when E85 has only 2/3rds the energy of E0 one should not be surprised to find 2/3rds the MPG. Which is exactly what the published EPA results show."

I have used up to E35 on multiple vehicle for years. My MPGs do not drop like Big Oil Shills claim they should. What is your experience with blending different percentages of Ethanol Mr. armchair expert AKA GrumpyCat?

[Edited by: krzysiek_ck at 5/28/2013 8:29:27 AM EST]
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Hannie59
All-Star Author Appleton

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Message Posted: May 28, 2013 7:39:05 AM

Jmac and Redrider are making false statements about mileage!

If their claims of up to 15% mileage difference with E-10 are correct, that would mean that the 10% ethanol was not ethanol, which is highly combustable, but in fact was water.

Theoretically, 15% mileage loss from E-0 to E-10 is impossible. That would mean that the ethanol is not burning at all. More BS from the oil patchers. Real world on most vehicles is 2% to 3% loss on E-10 vs. E-0


[Edited by: Hannie59 at 5/28/2013 7:41:20 AM EST]
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Jmac2008
Champion Author Missouri

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Message Posted: May 28, 2013 1:47:32 AM

There is more energy in gasoline than ethanol and I get about 10 to 15 % better mileage with regular gas without the ethanol.
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GrumpyCat
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Message Posted: May 28, 2013 12:38:37 AM

"Not necessarily. Stock ECUs are tuned for a range, sometimes a wide range, of driving parameters, including knock and operating temperature. Ethanol can give you better efficiency and that could mean better MPGs."

Efficiency of economy? MPG is economy, not efficiency. A common mistake by armchair ethanol apologists who only play with rhetoric and do not understand math, chemistry, or engineering.

I have never claimed ethanol was more or less efficient than gasoline. But when E85 has only 2/3rds the energy of E0 one should not be surprised to find 2/3rds the MPG. Which is exactly what the published EPA results show.

And likewise with gasoline at $3/gallon ethanol has to be $2.00/gallon or less to be competitive.

When production of ethanol consumes 80% of its energy content from non-renewable sources any and all claims of "renewable" are void. We would be better off to consume natural gas and diesel in their original forms rather than convert to ethanol.
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