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Author Topic: How about focusing on major problems( ie cash/credit )instead of trivial things Back to Topics
MustangEddie

Champion Author
Long Island

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Message Posted: May 7, 2014 2:13:35 AM

The cash/credit debacle between the app & the website has now lingered on for 40 days effectively fouling up the main purpose of this site which is reporting correct gas prices.People cried about the moving of the news items & that trivial thing was changed in 4 days.Here on my local site all the statistical data is all but useless as it is skewed from some people posting cash & others posting credit as the main price. Also the highest list is hard to believe because I think most are credit prices.I understand that this is more easily said than done so instead how about rescinding the app update that caused this problem until a resolution is reached.
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RichWLIN
Champion Author Indiana

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Message Posted: Jun 19, 2014 7:45:58 AM

It should be obvious by now that the parties responsible for reprogramming the web site lack an understanding of how the site is intended to perform.

Before someone says that this is negative or a slur, let's consider the recent history of changes and the unwanted results. Which would you rather believe? That the unwanted or ill-conceived modifications are on purpose? or by accident?

It sure seems that every time a suggested or needed feature is initiated, other perhaps equally important functions are simultaneously disabled. The most recent cash/credit programming changes appear to coincide with the inability to zero bogus prices.

We might want to rethink what we ask for, it sure seems likely now that there will be unintended consequences.

RG

P.S. (these remarks are suitable for a number of current threads)


[Edited by: RichWLIN at 6/19/2014 7:47:38 AM EST]
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scoutmaster
Champion Author Pittsburgh

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Message Posted: Jun 19, 2014 6:43:05 AM

I hear ya Gas Buddy. The days when route #'s were allowed and exit #'s were allowed. The days when one could zero a bad price and the moderators actually did something!

I did get this from the mods regarding zeroing prices.

Hello scoutmaster,

I have forwarded this feedback along to our development team for review to be fixed, they're aware of the problem and it should corrected in the near future. Thank you for bringing this to our attention.

Regards,

Ryan (RD)
GasBuddy.com
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TxJeans
Champion Author Tampa

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Message Posted: Jun 19, 2014 6:25:10 AM

All I wanted was a BUYER BEWARE warning flag for dual priced stations ;-)

I notice that the dual priced stations that used to show on my search aren't showing up....looking at my FSL they have NO prices posted -- cash or credit. I don't remember seeing them w/out prices before...Oh well, I don't buy from CITGO and EXXON anyhow and they are the bulk of dual priced in my area.
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Gas_Buddy
Champion Author Maryland

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Message Posted: Jun 18, 2014 11:18:06 PM

Anyone want to reminisce about the good old days when this was a simple and efficient website even if it didn't do everything everyone wanted?
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MustangEddie
Champion Author Long Island

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Message Posted: Jun 18, 2014 8:31:29 PM

There are many problems with the latest update.Among them is comments are no longer being posted even if you saved them on your FSL. The time stamp feature no longer works. Every price post shows on the site as posted a moment ago even if you put a different time from the pull down list.If you post cash prices for all grades in the cash boxes the reg & premium prices show up right but the mid and diesel prices show up in the credit boxes.Even though the lowest price available is supposed to show as the main price on the website I've found many stations that are showing the credit price as the main price even though there are lower cash prices posted for them.And the biggest glitch of all to me is there is no way to zero out wrong prices & prices for non existent grades anymore.I guess this update was rolled out without any beta testing... sigh oh well .



[Edited by: MustangEddie at 6/18/2014 8:32:47 PM EST]
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rando991
All-Star Author Missouri

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Message Posted: Jun 18, 2014 10:54:14 AM

+1 on what Rich says. I noticed that too.
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Zimcity
Champion Author Twin Cities

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Message Posted: Jun 18, 2014 9:09:31 AM

" There needs to be a selection for cash or credit when searching and the prices displayed after a search need to be the same."

Filters, Filters, Filters!!!

° cash
° credit
° both
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RichWLIN
Champion Author Indiana

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Message Posted: Jun 17, 2014 6:10:58 PM

Seems that if you want to search for the credit price you need to select the map after locating stations where the credit price still appears. Not quite there yet is it?

This will cause confusion. It is unlikely that both prices will display well on the map. There needs to be a selection for cash or credit when searching and the prices displayed after a search need to be the same.
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rando991
All-Star Author Missouri

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Message Posted: Jun 17, 2014 5:36:01 PM

Yay! Credit and Cash prices now showing on the web.
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TxJeans
Champion Author Tampa

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Message Posted: Jun 17, 2014 5:14:47 PM

Yawn -- guess I will leave the homestead today just to get some prices to post. Wonder what I will find when I do.

They would have been much better just throwing up the durable flag a year or so ago and worked on the matching the grades to the MSL first and getting feedback.

The problem with searching cash vs credit is that for the credit, it may not be updated all the time as many areas of the country do NOT have the cash and credit both posted on the CURB sign. And, the CURB sign, I would think would be the most often reported prices. I know that we have one GB around here that claims he drives up to the pumps for all stations he reports, but most of us don't drive up unless we are buying something Gas or going into the store. And, the search/price lists will be easier on the website with more real estate to handle it than the app.

I buy gas about every 1 to 2 weeks depending on if I travel to my folks or not.

Off to look at what they did.
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Scrapheap
Champion Author Virginia

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Message Posted: Jun 17, 2014 5:04:32 PM

Problems?

GasBuddy Direct is still posting cash prices in the credit field.

A cash price for midgrade that I reported showed up in the credit field on my FSL though the regular and premium price reports were correct.

There does not seem to be a way to search for credit prices either on the full site or on the app.

Unmatched stations in the FSL were useful breaks that many of us used. Removing unmatched stations completely was a big mistake.
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MustangEddie
Champion Author Long Island

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Message Posted: Jun 17, 2014 5:02:14 PM

Rich just go to the thread about cash/credit coming to the site.Been trying to go through it with TB don't want to rehash all of it here.
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RichWLIN
Champion Author Indiana

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Message Posted: Jun 17, 2014 4:53:43 PM

So, what sort of problems are you seeing? I have so few dual priced stations to compare. The nearest seem to be working correctly with the exception of one that people have been entering cash prices in both app fields to make the cash price appear online. This should be sorted out shortly.

We still have the tax exempt diesel cash/credit problem with the truck stops but this is really a separate issue.
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Scrapheap
Champion Author Virginia

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Message Posted: Jun 17, 2014 3:07:19 PM

So does anyone know how to search for credit prices?
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scoutmaster
Champion Author Pittsburgh

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Message Posted: Jun 17, 2014 2:37:38 PM

"He claims it was said tongue-in-cheek. However, as often as he has mis-used terms and phrases in the past, and as there were no contextual cues that would indicate that was the case, I have my doubts."

So now I'm lying, Byte_Doctor?
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MustangEddie
Champion Author Long Island

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Message Posted: Jun 17, 2014 1:47:49 PM

Well Rich it's in place but not exactly functional lots of problems here.And your p.s. is correct.
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Byte_Doctor
Champion Author Akron

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Message Posted: Jun 17, 2014 1:46:35 PM

Rich, yes it was the scoutmaster that misused the phrase "persona non gratis".

He claims it was said tongue-in-cheek. However, as often as he has mis-used terms and phrases in the past, and as there were no contextual cues that would indicate that was the case, I have my doubts.

He also seems to think I have him on ignore. Perhaps this will disabuse him of that notion and help him to understand that I generally choose to ignore him, but am perfectly capable of seeing everything he posts.
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RichWLIN
Champion Author Indiana

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Message Posted: Jun 17, 2014 1:27:13 PM

Yup, looks like cash/credit is in place and functional. Now if we can just get back to showing only the grades of fuel that are selected in the MSL we'll be sitting in high cotton.

RG

P.S. Let me guess, it was the scoutmaster with the "persona non gratis" malapropism?
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scoutmaster
Champion Author Pittsburgh

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Message Posted: Jun 17, 2014 1:11:11 PM

Someone tell Byte_Doctor, since he has me on ignore, I understand what the phrase means. It was said tongue-in-cheek.
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Kinglemuel
All-Star Author North Carolina

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Message Posted: Jun 17, 2014 12:44:50 PM

Thanks to GB for revising the website to solve this problem; I was not aware that it was a problem until yesterday. Nice to be able to post the correct cash/credit price on the website.
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MustangEddie
Champion Author Long Island

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Message Posted: Jun 17, 2014 11:24:47 AM

I agree with Scrapheap most of the garbage prices have been common place since the start of the app.The cash/credit disconnect between the app & the website has just magnified the problem.
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Byte_Doctor
Champion Author Akron

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Message Posted: Jun 17, 2014 10:53:59 AM

"Why would the moderators be persona non gratis (unwelcome) here?"

They aren't unwelcome - the member who wrote that apparently did not understand the meaning of that phrase.

[Edited by: Byte_Doctor at 6/17/2014 10:54:10 AM EST]
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Scrapheap
Champion Author Virginia

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Message Posted: Jun 17, 2014 9:36:54 AM

Most of the garbage price posts in my area are coming from app users.
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rando991
All-Star Author Missouri

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Message Posted: Jun 17, 2014 9:17:41 AM

Here's my fix for this whole mess. Just shut down the website price reports...allow the web users to see the prices reported by the mobile reports. People don't drive around with a laptop looking for the lowest price. They do it with their phones. OR just break the link altogether. Let the phone app users and web users post their own prices and neither the twain shall meet. I'd rather that than continue to have the web users post over my app reports with garbage prices.
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JKazakus
Veteran Author Indiana

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Message Posted: Jun 17, 2014 8:07:22 AM

Why would the moderators be persona non gratis (unwelcome) here?

It would think that input and answers from someone in the company would be welcomed by all?

The more I read these topics, the less I understand about gas buddy.
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scoutmaster
Champion Author Pittsburgh

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Message Posted: Jun 17, 2014 7:05:09 AM

The moderators are persona non gratis! They seemed to have climbed into a hole and are not coming out. My dad always said if you can't take the heat, get a new job!
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MustangEddie
Champion Author Long Island

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Message Posted: Jun 17, 2014 1:06:34 AM

80 days since the app update & 27 days since the cash credit announcement & STILL no resolution.Again how about focusing on real problems & forget about new bogus give aways,etc.
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TxJeans
Champion Author Tampa

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Message Posted: Jun 16, 2014 6:06:02 PM

I wish they would spend some of the money for the new sweepstakes in fixing code...I don't see much benefit for more members posting prices that are not posted correctly does much -- oh, wait, it increases CLICK revenue.

We probably provide more click revenue when there are tough times on the site than good times....

Sigh...
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scoutmaster
Champion Author Pittsburgh

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Message Posted: Jun 16, 2014 4:10:39 PM

TxJeans,

I do use the site around me. Prices vary from one community to the next and they don't change in sync.

I agree they should have done things in smaller bites and the linking grades to the MSL would have been beneficial site wide while the cash/credit thing doesn't benefit everyone.
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RichWLIN
Champion Author Indiana

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Message Posted: Jun 16, 2014 3:24:10 PM

For the brief period of beta testing, the new app was working perfectly in my area where no issues with cash/credit were discerned. I don't buy from the few stations that have dual pricing so I can't say with certainty how prices were appearing on the full web site. I did not notice. Presumably, it was then like it is now.

During the beta, only the grades of fuel found in the MSL were being displayed in the app. It was necessary to edit some of the MSL's and make them current with the products stations are now offering, but once this was accomplished, the app itself was working flawlessly and it was both easier to use in terms of entering prices, and perhaps more importantly, prohibiting overzealous members from entering grades of fuel that don't exist.

At the first public rollout of the new app, the cash/credit feature was retained but all four grades were added back in? This was very disappointing. Shortly thereafter the ability to make MSL suggested changes was added to the new app, but we still have all four grade fields available for input. The disappointment continues.

It doesn't seem to do any good complaining here. Might as well start a topic on suggesting weather conditions. We obviously don't understand why these app and website changes are being made this way. One of the moderators apparently jumped the gun allowing as how the fixes were coming shortly, and now since this hasn't happened he has no doubt been silenced from any further such embarrassing communications. We probably have to wait now until the changes are actually in place before any further reports.

RG
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TxJeans
Champion Author Tampa

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Message Posted: Jun 14, 2014 9:52:01 AM

Scout, for me locally, the pricing really doesn't help that much -- unless/until a new player comes to town, I can pretty much guess which stations on my route are the best price. It is only when I travel, or during brief periods of extra high volatility that GB becomes really valuable to me, but that may be different for others in different markets than I am in or that travel a lot.

The fact that they have allowed the broken app updates to stay this long when it seems it should have been an easy mapping issue to fix (unless this entire house of cards is so patch-worked that it is on life support and any wrong move would bring it all down), perplexes me. Then the announcement of the website changes being imminent and announced on the what's new, and the way the survey was rolled out makes me really wonder what is going on at GBO.

I hope it is not a struggle between GB and OPIS that is causing the lack of communication and the many mis-steps. I had hoped that OPIS would be the key to bringing the software out of the garage design to a nicely re-factored set of programs.

They probably would have done much better by taking things in smaller bites and fixing the linking of fuel grades to the MSL and just throwing up the DUAL price flag and getting that rolled out and stabilized and looked at the feed back to the DDPF and then tried to address the cash/credit more completely....unless they went for a total redesign and refactoring of base code.

But hey, that is just my view from the outside looking in.
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scoutmaster
Champion Author Pittsburgh

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Message Posted: Jun 14, 2014 7:54:43 AM

I've never thought of leaving. This site has gone down hill but it is still the best place to find gas prices. Once they get the cash/credit problem fixed and the issue with posting prices for grades a station doesn't carry, the site will improve.
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RichWLIN
Champion Author Indiana

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Message Posted: Jun 14, 2014 5:33:08 AM

Reminded of Obamacare programming...late and wrong.
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MustangEddie
Champion Author Long Island

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Message Posted: Jun 14, 2014 1:43:13 AM

TxJeans ,Thought the same as you although the site was only down 10 minutes here so not much of an effort.I don't know why I still bother either other than it has become a habit now coming up on 9 years.Lately I find I'm spending most of my time battling the people who insist on posting credit prices from the app which appear wrong on the website.I even had one clown tell me I "must" use the app to post"properly".Really getting tired of what is becoming a losing battle. Rich ,It has now been 77 days since the app update which caused the problem & 24 days since the cash/credit is coming to the website post.Way too long for both.



[Edited by: MustangEddie at 6/14/2014 1:48:57 AM EST]
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TxJeans
Champion Author Tampa

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Message Posted: Jun 13, 2014 2:41:32 PM

TPTB have been even quieter than usual. This morning I had trouble accessing the site and thought maybe they were bringing up the "new" website version. Maybe they tried again and had to back it out due to performance again.

I find myself making less and less effort to post prices. Yawn...
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RichWLIN
Champion Author Indiana

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Message Posted: Jun 13, 2014 2:22:27 PM

So how many days has this check been in the mail now?
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TxJeans
Champion Author Tampa

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Message Posted: Jun 7, 2014 7:48:31 AM

On May 8 CC posted this:

<<<"After an enormous effort by our development team (and after many requests), we are finally offering the ability to report both cash and credit prices on Android and iOS. We hope to include this in our apps for BlackBerry and Windows Phone, as well as our full website in the near future. Thanks for your patience.">>>

We are losing patience with the poor implementation, apparent insufficient testing, and lack of resolution of the price mapping issues between the APP and WEB.

<<<"When reporting cash & credit prices from Android or iOS, we welcome both or either price, in the provided fields. The cheapest of the two prices will be displayed on the price list page. Both prices will be shown on the station details page.">>>>

If someone posts the higher credit price w/out posting the cash, would this not be seen as the "cheaper price" then and be incorrect?

This is worse than just giving a durable buyer beware flag...especially with the mapping errors. That is why I suggested starting with the durable flag and getting feedback from the membership before trying to tame the dragon of dual pricing that varies from area to area of the country. As I said before, except where mandated to display both prices on the CURB SIDE SIGN, the posting and sorting and filtering will be problematic due to lack of ready data.

So if the PRICE page doesn't have an indicator for dual pricing, how would one know to look at the details page and why would one want to sit their and go through station after station to find the credit prices? *
Disclaimer - I have NOT updated the APP based on the posts here, and am waiting for the Website to catch up and see if issues are resolved.

I think you would have been better served (considering resources and skill set and the patchwork of coding on the website from years of growth) to have focused more on the following:
1- Linking of reportable fuel grades to MSL
2- Updating price map mapping
3- Improving search features (forum and ZIP code price searches)
4- Improving the trip calculator (I find the current rather useless)
And just throwing up a "Cash/Credit durable flag and then build some input before tackling that monster.

I find it odd that GBO did not find the price mapping between the APPs and WEB in testing, and more so that it hasn't been pulled or resolved yet.

<<<"When reporting cash/credit prices from BlackBerry, Windows Phone, or from our full website, we ask that you post the cash price where it exists. If the station does not offer a cash price, the standard price should be reported.">>>

Again part of the problem is that some areas post both at the CURB, some post CASH at the CURB and there are apparently areas where they are mandated to post the CREDIT/HIGHER price at the CURB.

If they do not offer a CASH price, wouldn't that be a CREDIT price and posted to the CREDIT field?

Sorry - Calls it as I see it, and others are free to disagree.

<<<"Cash/credit is very new on GasBuddy. We are still working out some problems. Our developers are aware of a problem that causes some credit prices to be displayed on the website, despite the fact that there is a lower cash price also available. They are working on having this resolved as soon as possible.:>>>>

Still waiting...

<<<"As mentioned, cash/credit is on it's way for all GasBuddy platforms. GasBuddy is a VERY big system and we are still a relatively small staff. I assure you, everyone is working to make GasBuddy as good as it can be.">>>

Still waiting...

[Edited by: TxJeans at 6/7/2014 7:53:01 AM EST]
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MustangEddie
Champion Author Long Island

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Message Posted: Jun 7, 2014 1:26:40 AM

70 days since the app update & 17 days since the cash/credit announcement yet still no resolution. C'mon GB it's way past time to get off the pot & fix this core problem.
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scoutmaster
Champion Author Pittsburgh

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Message Posted: May 27, 2014 6:59:07 AM

According to TB

Message Posted: May 26, 2014 6:49:51 PM
I believe the plan is for us to roll out the update tomorrow to the local sites.

That would be today.
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MustangEddie
Champion Author Long Island

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Message Posted: May 27, 2014 12:22:01 AM

60 days & still not resolved. Also has been 7 days since the cash/credit announcement.Any solid date when this will happen? When the cash/credit deal hits the website will the mismapping problem be fixed????

[Edited by: MustangEddie at 5/27/2014 12:25:41 AM EST]
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MBAcura
Champion Author Orlando

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Message Posted: May 17, 2014 5:49:48 PM

I agree it does seem like a fairly core piece of the system. Maybe the good tester was out sick that day. Or maybe it was what we call in Engineering circles in Central Florida, Space Shuttle mentality. No disrespect to those who lost their lives in Challenger, of course, but the management of that project forced things through testing and QA confidence intervals to "Make it Fly".

[Edited by: MBAcura at 5/17/2014 5:51:53 PM EST]
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TxJeans
Champion Author Tampa

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Message Posted: May 17, 2014 11:55:40 AM

Valid point, but this one seems that it should be reasonably easy to fit into a reasonable regression test set to discover and not require the level of "fine art, mastered by few" Other nuances, maybe not...

Just saying...

Especially since they have been pretty evasive about the issue.
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MBAcura
Champion Author Orlando

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Message Posted: May 17, 2014 11:34:37 AM

"It still amazes me that they didn't discover this in testing."

Regression testing can be a fine art, mastered by few.
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MBAcura
Champion Author Orlando

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Message Posted: May 17, 2014 11:33:31 AM

"Ya know TxJeans, it could be their code is such patchwork that it needs completely blown up and rebuilt."

Hear hear. My bet is that this ballooned quickly, way beyond the original developers ability to maintain it. It's probably a big plate of spaghetti, and needs a redesign effort, which is probably too large of a capital investment to justify the current level of dissatisfaction.

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TxJeans
Champion Author Tampa

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Message Posted: May 17, 2014 11:12:32 AM

regarding <<<..."they may not have made the problem for users of the web site any better, but rationalize that they haven’t made it much worse than it already was. This is one possible excuse for the rather lengthy delay in correcting this problem...">>>>

This might be an excuse for not fixing it promptly, but I suspect that it was a mapping error that should have been caught in pre-testing and that fixing it is not a priority because they are working on updating the Web Site to take the cash/credit fields and don't want to possibly fix something now and break something in the future code they are working on. Hopefully, they will do better cross system testing with the next change. If they are updating the website or any of the individual apps w/out regression testing across the full platform of devices we will continue to see these sort of issues with future updates.

It still amazes me that they didn't discover this in testing. I don't necessarily agree that it has not made it much worse for some members on the site. They just must be assuming that the number of those directly affected are small and didn't take into account that even those that aren't directly affected might lose some confidence in the accuracy of the site due to discussions of this mess up.

Sorry GBO -this is just how it appears to me. I appreciate what you say you are offering us, just no longer have a lot of confidence in priorities and implementation.
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scoutmaster
Champion Author Pittsburgh

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Message Posted: May 17, 2014 8:02:54 AM

Ya know TxJeans, it could be their code is such patchwork that it needs completely blown up and rebuilt.
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RichWLIN
Champion Author Indiana

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Message Posted: May 17, 2014 7:34:14 AM

Maybe it's time to reconsider that this may not be a programming mistake at all.

One practical explanation was put forth earlier in this thread:

..."they may not have made the problem for users of the web site any better, but rationalize that they haven’t made it much worse than it already was. This is one possible excuse for the rather lengthy delay in correcting this problem..."

Somehow this statement was construed as "armchair psychology" yet it seems a more convincing argument for the status quo than believing that this is a bug that was overlooked in testing and allowed to remain in place for the last 50 days.

In any case, the problem is still here.

RG

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TxJeans
Champion Author Tampa

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Message Posted: May 17, 2014 12:26:01 AM

It still amazes me that they couldn't find this bug in their testing -- unless they are so sloppy as to test each app independent of the other apps and the website.
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MustangEddie
Champion Author Long Island

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Message Posted: May 17, 2014 12:09:01 AM

50 days & still no resolution.Time to rescind this update or here's another idea.Make the site & the app two separate entities so one doesn't clash with the other.
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Gas_Buddy
Champion Author Maryland

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Message Posted: May 13, 2014 2:54:53 PM

"it was actually this conversation: "Do want the battery charger and battery? Also, how about a lens?" (the seller). Me: "what do you mean? a lens, you mean an extra lens?" Them: "No, the lens is extra, this is just the camcorder body."

Sorry for the diversion, but as a photographer with somewhat of a background, while I can't speak or camcorders, high end cameras have been and still are sold by the body, not with the lens. But I do understand your point.

As scoutmaster said, though, you're painting with a wide paintbrush. Many things are sold, including wedding packages and construction/farm equipment with options that many people consider basic. That's the reason you see a $25,000 or $$30,000 pickup truck averaging over $40,000 when it goes out the door.
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