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fingaz

Rookie Author
New Jersey

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Message Posted: Apr 11, 2013 5:56:06 PM

We should be able to post the cash AND the credit price. Otherwise, the prices are very misleading.

Around me, prices vary wildly between cash and credit. Stations A may have a lower cash price than Station B down the street, however, Station B may have a lower credit price than station A. If only the cash price is listed and I need to pay credit, then GasBuddy actually gives me incorrect information because on station may have a lower credit price, but a higher cash price.

Also, I see that sometimes people post the credit price while others post the cash prices, so the price per gallon isn't always correct. This app would be MUCH more useful to me if they had the cash/credit price. I normally don't carry around a ton of cash on me so I use my debit card instead.
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Don
Moderator
Message Posted: Jul 10, 2013 6:40:59 PM

For information on how to report cash and credit prices in areas where this two-tier pricing system exists, see our cash and credit pricing FAQ

Cash and credit pricing is not yet a national pricing standard, and two tier price is not available in many areas throughout Canada and the U.S., which is why it has not yet been implemented as a full permanent feature in the GB sites and apps.

However, we're currently in the process of collecting information about stations that offer cash and credit pricing through the apps and Master Station List options.

For the time being please follow the instructions in the FAQ and your related local area price posting guidelines.

-Don



[Edited by: Don at 7/10/2013 6:41:34 PM EST]
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scoutmaster
Champion Author Pittsburgh

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Message Posted: Jul 7, 2013 10:00:07 PM

I don't pay any interest on my credit card either and I get 5% cash back. The last time I bought gas my final cost was $3.19/gallon with the pump price being $3.38.
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TxJeans
Champion Author Tampa

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Message Posted: Jul 7, 2013 7:52:24 PM

@superman1AZ

I pay no interest and get 5% cash back with a credit card that is used on a budget much the same as with a debit card, but with more protection.

The problem is localized in some areas being being a rare phenomenon and in other areas much more prevalent. And, the sign-age requirements vary from community to community or state. Add in the fact that GB first had users posting cash, then credit and then back to cash w/out a prominent announcement, there has been a lot of confusion on how to report.

If you read through this thread, you will understand some of the issues regarding the posting of both prices and that Gas Buddy PTB are supposedly working on the issue with some baby steps. Any changes have to be well planned out to consider the fact that they have multiple sites on multiple servers and several APPS (Android, Apple, Windows, Blackberry) to consider in the mix.

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superman1AZ
Rookie Author Phoenix

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Message Posted: Jul 7, 2013 7:38:52 PM

In Phoenix area, cash and credit is same at the majors, except for Arco, which is best paid for cash. There's a 45 cent fee for debit card use. I use debit cards at the majors because I don't want to pay interest on gas.
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TxJeans
Champion Author Tampa

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Message Posted: Jul 5, 2013 7:07:44 PM

mcdowelle: "In my area of the southern Catskills, every CITGO station has a cash and credit price, with the exception that a CITGO credit card is the same as cash. At the street, on the big sign, the cash price for Regular is posted with a tiny sign saying cash. The only other price on the big sign is for Diesel. This seems to be a CITGO or local franchiser decision"

It is the same here in FL. The check out fee is different than the "cash discount". Citgo, BP, Exxon, etc. do the dual pricing for gas here in Tampa Bay - and the Florida requires a small sign usually like a very large notebook size hanging off the side of the street side sign.
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mcdowelle
Veteran Author New York

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Message Posted: Jul 5, 2013 5:42:36 PM

In my area of the southern Catskills, every CITGO station has a cash and credit price, with the exception that a CITGO credit card is the same as cash. At the street, on the big sign, the cash price for Regular is posted with a tiny sign saying cash. The only other price on the big sign is for Diesel. This seems to be a CITGO or local franchiser decision.

How can this be if this is illegal in New York? I've read through the posts on "check-out-fee" but it still looks like it is not legal to me.

I understand that the stations do this primarily to get customers into their convenience store rather than to recover the cost of credit card processing. This is understandable but still dirty pool unless both prices are posted conspicuously.
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scoutmaster
Champion Author Pittsburgh

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Message Posted: Jul 5, 2013 9:59:39 AM

Here are the states where it is illegal to charge the "check-out fee"

California
Colorado
Connecticut
Florida
Kansas
Maine
Massachusetts
New York
Oklahoma
Texas
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TxJeans
Champion Author Tampa

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Message Posted: Jul 5, 2013 7:50:38 AM

Orange County: Cheaper Gas--Some readers also questioned whether the cash-price signs are legal under state law. McKeeman said that California law prohibits surcharges for credit-card use. But discounts are OK, so long as the retailer posts both prices. "It's a subtle difference," he said.

I guess this explains a bit about why you see both prices more in CA than in other states. This was from 2010, before the "check out fee" that took place nationally in 2013 and references state law.

From my previous link: "This fee doesn't apply to purchases made using debit cards. And it will still be illegal to charge the new fee in 10 states, including New York, California and Texas. " (FL is also one of the 10 states)
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TxJeans
Champion Author Tampa

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Message Posted: Jul 5, 2013 7:32:25 AM

From what I understand, the processing at the pumps and at the cash register can be different. I know that for many "points" CCs you have to pay at the pump, and that at some stations the DEBIT card must be used inside to get the CASH discount and at the pump are treated like a CC. So there will never be a perfect solution for all users of all payment types.
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kwzh
Champion Author San Jose

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Message Posted: Jul 5, 2013 12:48:30 AM

Which is, of course, a difference that is not really a difference at all.
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scoutmaster
Champion Author Pittsburgh

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Message Posted: Jul 4, 2013 6:05:52 PM

"I believe the ability of stations to have different cash and credit prices depends on the terms of the credit card processor's contract with the station."

Your belief is incorrect CampKohler. A merchant may charge a cheaper price for cash transactions but they are not allowed to charge more for credit transactions.
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TxJeans
Champion Author Tampa

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Message Posted: Jul 4, 2013 5:59:28 PM

I think the "now legal" comment came about as a mis-understanding of the "check out fee" settlement:

Check Out Fee
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CampKohler
Champion Author Sacramento

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Message Posted: Jul 4, 2013 5:22:47 PM

I believe the ability of stations to have different cash and credit prices depends on the terms of the credit card processor's contract with the station. That would depend entirely on market conditions and competition between processors; if once processor insisted on no difference, and another did not, the latter would win out. I doubt whether any governmental action, hence legality, would enter in to it, although you can be assured the processors would dearly like to be able to say, "Sorry, it's not us; it's the law."

[Edited by: CampKohler at 7/4/2013 5:25:40 PM EST]
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scoutmaster
Champion Author Pittsburgh

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Message Posted: Jul 4, 2013 7:56:51 AM

"Its now legal for gas stations to have separate prices for credit and cash."

It has always been legal!

[Edited by: scoutmaster at 7/4/2013 7:58:08 AM EST]
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TxJeans
Champion Author Tampa

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Message Posted: Jul 4, 2013 6:17:24 AM

smurra36: "Most stations around me have two prices. There has to be a way GB can list both prices - don't see why it hasn't been done ages ago when this became prevalent. "

This my be "prevalent" around you, but from a poll not that long ago, it is not prevalent around the country. How to address the issue is not just as simple as it seems on the surface due to the various reporting methods at the stations.

Apparently the FAQ was originally to post the CASH price, but then because of so many using CREDIT, the FAQ was changed to CREDIT. Well, that had it's own problems since MOST places post the CASH price (if there is a difference) at the curb sign, not the CREDIT. So, in reality it is what is posted at the curb sign that most often will get posted.

If you check out "What's New"you will see that they are starting to work on how to address the issue. There is now a Checkbox on the MSL. There are also reports of pop-up questions on some of the APP versions that ask various questions about the station you are posting (including the dual price issue).

This is only the first step. Just including two sets of fields does not alone solve the problem for credit people.

In most parts of the country both prices are not available at the curb.

Apparently much of CA posts both prices of all grades.

Many places don't have any notice, or an easily missed "hang tag" that people may not notice (FL).

Many places don't even post all grades let alone cash and credit price at the curb.

While most post the cash price when a difference, there are some that post the credit and X amount off with cash (maybe due to state rule, or haven't updated signs due to competition or the fact that locals are used to it now that they can charge a "different" price legitimately w/out running into problems with their CC agreements).

Then there is how they treat DEBIT -most treat DEBIT (which many consider as "cash") the same as CREDIT when used directly at the pump and cash if inside.

Some don't offer a cash discount on all fuel types, or at the same spread. The spread for cash/credit may change with each price change, and not be a consistent X amount with every delivery and every grade.

Since most prices are posted from the curb signs, this means that even with dual fields, the CREDIT people (me included) will still not have all the data they hope for, and will have to look at CASH and hope they can figure out if the CREDIT will be better or worse than the single priced station a bit further down the road.

There are just so many flavors of pricing and even "grades of fuel" that the system will never be perfect.

That said, unless the stations nation-wide are required to post all grades at the street, providing dual fields will NOT totally solve the problem. Changes will just give the person a heads up.



[Edited by: TxJeans at 7/4/2013 6:20:32 AM EST]
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smurra36
Rookie Author New York

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Message Posted: Jul 3, 2013 11:24:16 PM

Most stations around me have two prices. There has to be a way GB can list both prices - don't see why it hasn't been done ages ago when this became prevalent.
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knoxcounty
Rookie Author Knoxville

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Message Posted: Jun 23, 2013 6:02:48 PM

Its now legal for gas stations to have separate prices for credit and cash.
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mcdowelle
Veteran Author New York

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Message Posted: Jun 15, 2013 10:53:28 AM

On my trip from NY to VA and return the last couple of days I found in PA and VA mostly it was only the regular cash price posted on the "big sign". You had to be at the pump to see credit prices for all octane and you had to go inside to get the cash price for medium and premium. There were no prices on top of the pump to compare prices as there are in NY. This gave me a little more insight into the problem of reporting prices for all levels.
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fluxvalve
Rookie Author Seattle

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Message Posted: May 29, 2013 2:11:12 PM

Good luck posting a cash price if the station shows the credit price, along with a sign indicating a 10 cent per gallon discount for cash.

Whenever I correctly post the cash price, with a note in the comment field to add 10 cents for the credit price, someone will shortly come by and incorrectly report the credit price.

This is a major weak point of Gas Buddy, there really needs to be a better way to indicate cash or credit prices. Nobody seems to read the comments section.
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kwzh
Champion Author San Jose

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Message Posted: May 25, 2013 12:35:52 AM

mybigtruck: Unfortunately, in regions where the station only posts one price at the curb, there's no obvious way for a price spotter to know whether it's a dual-priced station or not. We've been advised that the development team is working on a solution, though.

Please post the cash price, and if possible also use the comment field to specify the difference (e.g., "+6c credit"). And if you notice a wrong price, overwrite it with the correct one. Until we have better software, there's not much more we can do.
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mybigtruck
Champion Author San Jose

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Message Posted: May 24, 2013 9:36:15 PM

I wished there's an check box option to indicate cash or credit price. Often I go to an unknown station and find out credit card price is higher.
There also seems to be an inconsistency of which price is posted when a station has both. Misleading sometimes!
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TxJeans
Champion Author Tampa

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Message Posted: May 18, 2013 10:33:46 AM

vangobond said "
I agree we should be able to post both, it would level the playing field "

This would not totally solve the problem. First, the dual set of fields would need to be tied to a dual price flag in the MSL, otherwise, it would likely add to the problem. In many areas it is not clear if the station is dual priced from the curb, or the sign does not post both prices. In FL we have a requirement for a "hang tag" that indicates the price on the sign is for CASH or Station Branded card - but it is easy to miss, especially by those that always pay cash, or are from out of the area.
.
Most stations here only post Reg or Reg+Diesel.
.
Apparently it started in the FAQs to require CASH, then changed to CREDIT, and back to CASH. Although more and more use a CARD to pay, it still makes more sense to post what is on the sign when only one price is posted (which would almost always be CASH).
.
WE NEED THE DURABLE FLAG visible in the PRICE lists!
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kmapjr
Champion Author Detroit

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Message Posted: May 17, 2013 11:38:00 PM

Here in Mi. I've never seen a lower price for credit, if you use credit it is almost always 10ยข more per gallon, sometimes more. I usually post the credit price in the comments section, as well as E-85 prices if the station has it.
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vangobrown
Veteran Author Wilmington

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Message Posted: May 14, 2013 4:11:11 PM

I agree we should be able to post both, it would level the playing field
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rspiano
Champion Author Tucson

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Message Posted: May 14, 2013 10:32:02 AM

The only places I have seen a cash/credit difference which applies to only diesel fuel are at certain truck stops on I-10 between Tucson and Phoenix. Their visible-for-miles neon signs show the regular gas price as constant, while the green diesel price will alternate between the cash and credit prices every few seconds.
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DavisSta
All-Star Author San Francisco

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Message Posted: May 14, 2013 3:18:22 AM

[reposting because GasBuddy long-URL bug resulted in "text deleted" in previous attempt]

On 11 Apr 2013 TxJeans posted: <<I understand CA has rules regarding posting both [cash and credit prices], but don't know about your state.>>

In the original poster's state (New Jersey), recent legislation made explicit the requirement to post both cash and credit prices, although it's still a little unclear whether signs attached to the pumps meet the requirement. In the past, the New Jersey Division of Consumer Affairs has contacted the New Jersey Gasoline Retailers Association to insist that roadside signs also clearly display both the cash and credit prices for gasoline, although compliance with this insistence was variable.
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DavisSta
All-Star Author San Francisco

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Message Posted: May 14, 2013 3:00:57 AM

On 11 Apr 2013 TxJeans posted: <<I understand CA has rules regarding posting both [cash and credit prices], but don't know about your state.>>

In the original poster's state (New Jersey), recent legislation (see http://www.judiciary.state.nj.us/legis/text deleted made explicit the requirement to post both cash and credit prices, although it's still a little unclear whether signs attached to the pumps meet the requirement. In the past, the New Jersey Division of Consumer Affairs has contacted the New Jersey Gasoline Retailers Association to insist that roadside signs also clearly display both the cash and credit prices for gasoline, although compliance with this insistence was variable.


[Edited by: DavisSta at 5/14/2013 3:05:37 AM EST]
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DavisSta
All-Star Author San Francisco

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Message Posted: May 14, 2013 1:33:17 AM

khawk858,

That's interesting that in Louisiana the price difference between cash and credit almost always only applies to diesel. I've almost never seen stations with that pricing scheme around here. My experience in California is that it's more common for a station to have different cash and credit prices for regular, midgrade, and premium gasoline but a single price (cash or credit) for diesel. But that's pretty unusual, too. Most of the stations around here that have different cash and credit prices have such a difference for all grades (gasoline and diesel).
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khawk858
Champion Author Shreveport

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Message Posted: May 14, 2013 12:56:11 AM

In Louisiana the price difference between cash and credit almost always only applies to diesel price. Is that common nationwide?
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TxJeans
Champion Author Tampa

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Message Posted: Apr 24, 2013 10:46:37 PM

I think he means the little hang tag on the side of the price board that indicates pricing is cash or brand card...

I was outside my normal travels yesterday and posted a price for a Mobil or Marathon. It wasn't until I was driving away from the nearby shop that I noticed the hang tag for cash/brand card.

In FL, I have yet (though I am sure there must be one somewhere) to find a station that posts both cash and credit. Heck, we are lucky if the post REG and DIESEL. Many places only post REG here.

I understand it is different in California....maybe even required by law?
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kwzh
Champion Author San Jose

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Message Posted: Apr 23, 2013 11:40:36 PM

Really, the CASH price is small? Since that's the lowest price, I'd expect it to be displayed more prominently than any other. Are there stations in your area that are displaying a small-font cash price and a large-font credit price for the same type of fuel?
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smugutu1234
Champion Author Tallahassee

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Message Posted: Apr 23, 2013 10:11:13 AM

That is a problem when seeing a sign....the cash price part is so small you can't see it until you are at the pump.
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RogerB
Champion Author Indianapolis

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Message Posted: Apr 19, 2013 7:18:24 AM

>> How do you enter a comment when reporting through the Android app?
>> How do you view those same comments when searching prices on the Android app? (jbaker6953)

Right under the "Time Spotted" field and above the "Submit Prices" button is the Comments field where a comment can be entered before submitting prices to be posted.

Any comments posted are displayed immediately below all the prices, in an additional field immediately below the field for the Diesel price. This field does not appear if there are no comments posted for that station.
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borsht
Champion Author Oakland

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Message Posted: Apr 18, 2013 9:16:49 PM

It would be great if GB had a list of changes they were considering and made it available for comment or feedback.
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TxJeans
Champion Author Tampa

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Message Posted: Apr 18, 2013 8:38:06 PM

borsht - Not surprised to see another CA poster on this topic.
There are several issues:
1 - Most of the country the dual pricing is the minority of stations if any.
2 - Most of the country they do not put both cash and credit on the street-side price sign. Heck, around here, you are lucking to get more than just regular.
3 - Without dual price fields you will have inconsistent pricing. Gas Buddy FAQs have changed from posting cash, to posting credit and now back to cash -- posting CASH makes sense because, as previously indicated, in most areas of the country that is what is posted at the street which is where most of the prices are obtained (do you pull into the pump at every station you post prices every day?)

What we need that Gasbuddy can provide, is a durable flag tied to the MSL to let us know if it is a dual priced station. Dual fields for cash and credit (again, best if tied to the MSL). Even then, I bet there is a problem with folks posting from the sign putting the wrong price in the wrong field.

What we need from the stations (but unlikely to get unless required by law - and I don't want more government decisions for things like that), is both cash and credit posted at the curb.

Apparently, it is required (or at least common) to post both at the curb in California.
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kwzh
Champion Author San Jose

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Message Posted: Apr 18, 2013 12:06:36 AM

borsht, that statistic is skewed because most parts of the country don't *have* dual pricing, and when purchasing at a mono-price station, most people will use credit even if they would otherwise take advantage of any available cash discounts.
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borsht
Champion Author Oakland

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Message Posted: Apr 17, 2013 9:31:53 PM

I noticed on another board that the question was asked, do you credit or cash? I appears that over 90% said they used credit. So, the posting of cash prices is not for the convenience of many. It is just the lowest price, but not the practical price.
As prices go higher, who is going to be carrying enough cast to fill up. Especially on a cross country trip, when you need gas buddy the most!
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cupboy
Champion Author Salt Lake City

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Message Posted: Apr 15, 2013 8:02:21 PM

Someone posting Slim Olson Chevron prices puts the cash price in for regular, and the credit price for regular in as mid-grade. How ridiculous. There is 7 cents difference in the prices.
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largobob
Champion Author Tampa

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Message Posted: Apr 15, 2013 9:39:54 AM

I think an easy fix to this can be found on the master station list. Any station that does cash credit different prices can have a box checked in the master station list along with a box afterward indicating what the "premium" is for using credit. The boxes can be down next to the grade indicators. The "default" would be cash and credit is the same price. This way and asterix could appears next to the price in the price postings. We would continue to post cash prices and the default listing would be cash price. You could change to credit though if you only want to see what credit pricing is. It would be some work updating the master station list to id cash pricing stations and some ongoing work when the "premium" increases or decreases but it would not take long to true everything up. After all, we members created the master list to begin with.

As it is now, I do not post prices for stations that differentiate between cash and credit. I do not want my name associated with misleading pricing. My opinion.
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CampKohler
Champion Author Sacramento

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Message Posted: Apr 12, 2013 4:35:08 PM

This suggestion has been added to the Suggestion Tracking List as a new topic on an existing subject.
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TxJeans
Champion Author Tampa

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Message Posted: Apr 12, 2013 7:42:22 AM

I never said it wasn't a problem. I have been saying they need to at least add a durable flag to indicate a dual priced station. However, adding the fields for cash and credit will not alone solve the problem. You live in LA - it is my understanding that CA requires both prices curb-side. Most of the country does not do that. Here, and apparently in many/most states you are lucky to see regular and diesel at the curb sign. In places like FL or elsewhere that don't post ALL prices at the curb, you will still have empty credit prices or - if they don't tie the field to the MSL or a durable flag, will have prices entered in wrong fields, just as diesel is often entered when no diesel.

Even with the dual price fields, you will likely find the credit field empty in many cases as most post from the curb (well - at least outside of your home state).

I have been calling for a durable flag for a long time.

Can't help with the APP as my route doesn't allow for me to safely report via the APP when driving due to traffic. I have cash/credit saved in the comments of my FSL on the website. I post by the website when I get to my destination or homesite (via computer or via firing up my browser).

PF -- Pentagon Federal Credit Union CC


[Edited by: TxJeans at 4/12/2013 7:44:08 AM EST]
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jbaker6953
Rookie Author Los Angeles

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Message Posted: Apr 12, 2013 3:00:50 AM

I agree with the original poster. This issue has led to me no longer using the Gas Buddy app to shop for gas prices as several times I've passed my regular station thinking I was going to get a better price later in the trip only to find out the actual price was HIGHER than my regular station. If I can't even tell how much I'm going to pay for gas, how does that make me more informed than not using the app at all?

As far as using the comments: How do you enter a comment when reporting through the Android app? How do you view those same comments when searching prices on the Android app? And finally, how do you filter out prices based on comments? Without these features, using the comments to address this issue is pointless.

PS - What's a PF card?



[Edited by: jbaker6953 at 4/12/2013 3:04:57 AM EST]
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TxJeans
Champion Author Tampa

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Message Posted: Apr 11, 2013 7:36:06 PM

<<<We should be able to post the cash AND the credit price. Otherwise, the prices are very misleading.>>>

The policy is to post the cash price. Ostensibly it is because it is the lowest price, but in reality, it is because it is almost always the price on the street price board. In many areas of the country (maybe most?) the stations do not post both prices. Additionally, it is "recommended" to put the cash/credit comments in the comment field. Unfortunately, this is not a durable field and most folks don't bother.

To implement this (which supposedly is under consideration or development) they would need to tie the fields to the MSL (or a durable flag indicating that it is dual priced). Then you still have the issue that in most states both prices are not posted street side from which most of the prices are obtained. So, you may see a lot of EMPTY credit price fields.<<<Around me, prices vary wildly between cash and credit. Stations A may have a lower cash price than Station B down the street, however, Station B may have a lower credit price than station A. If only the cash price is listed and I need to pay credit, then GasBuddy actually gives me incorrect information because on station may have a lower credit price, but a higher cash price.>>>

You will still have that problem with 2 sets of fields unless the stations are forced to post both because most drivers post based on the street side sign as they don't drive up to the pump except when actually filling up.

I understand CA has rules regarding posting both, but don't know about your state. In my state they do not have to post both prices - only a small hang tag indicating CASH/Brand Card. This sign is easily missed.

<<<Also, I see that sometimes people post the credit price while others post the cash prices, so the price per gallon isn't always correct. This app would be MUCH more useful to me if they had the cash/credit price. I normally don't carry around a ton of cash on me so I use my debit card instead.>>>

Unfortunately there is a lot of confusion on which price as GB has changed the faqs back and forth w/out announcement. Additionally, those that use CCs often just plain buck the system. Therefore, the durable flag tied to the MSL will at least give us CC users fair warning.

BTW - I have yet to see a Cash Discount station offer prices that beat my PF 5% cash back card at the single mode station nearby. And, since I pay no annual fee, and no interest, it is my best value.
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