Gas_Buddy
Champion Author
Maryland
Posts:25,967
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Message Posted: Feb 6, 2013 2:58:21 PM
To clarify, I did not say I'm in favor of mPOINTS, nor am I advocating it for anything. I only tried to explain what another member suggested about a program I didn't think many (most?) Gas Buddy members were familiar with. The only explanation the member provided about mPOINTS was "Then again, you might have the same problems you say you have now." In any case, why suggest a program that will give you the same problems "you have now."
171-500D
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scoutmaster
Champion Author
Pittsburgh
Posts:81,291
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Message Posted: Feb 6, 2013 8:56:38 AM
I agree rumbleseat. No member in good standing should be excluded.
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rumbleseat
Champion Author
Winnipeg
Posts:22,925
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Message Posted: Feb 6, 2013 8:02:33 AM
Doesn't matter if there is a fee or cost, or if it is free, if all the Canadian members are shut out from mPoints, such a change would be detrimental to GasBuddy. The site clearly states it is a US only membership.
Doesn't matter if there is a fee or cost, or if it is free, if Smartphone apps are required for participation, such a change would be further detrimental to GasBuddy. The site only lists certain apps that work with the site, and some of the participating merchants and services only work with one of the apps.
Plus, the maximum single reward that can be taken from the service is $25.
How many people, realistically, would welcome a switch to a system that made GasBuddy contributions to the points part of a basket of points from games and other crap, happy to save points to cash in for $25 certificate instead of a $250 gas card!
I believe this is a non-starter.
[Edited by: rumbleseat at 2/6/2013 8:05:07 AM EST]
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scoutmaster
Champion Author
Pittsburgh
Posts:81,291
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Message Posted: Feb 5, 2013 9:29:39 PM
Is there a fee or cost to the site owner to participate in mPoints?
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Gas_Buddy
Champion Author
Maryland
Posts:25,967
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Message Posted: Feb 5, 2013 7:11:49 PM
While it has nothing to do with the original suggestion of increasing the number of fuel posts that earn points, for those that aren't familiar with mPOINTS, mPOINTS are the mobile web's universal virtual reward currency. You can collect mPOINTS across a network of participating apps by doing the things you already doing within those apps, and you can redeem your mPOINTS for gift cards, promotions or donate them to any number of worthy charities. In the case of mMOBILE's "sweepstakes (or to use your mPOINTS for items in the mPOINTS Rewards store), you enter the "Rewards" tab in the mPOINTS Portal; select the , afterwhich your mPOINT balance will be reduced by the stated mPOINT cost of the reward.
Maybe I'm missing something but all you'd be doing by changing to the mPOINTS system is substituting something pretty much the same for what you already have. It doesn't seem that it would add anything to what Gas Buddy already has or is doing, let alone have anything to do with gas price posting.
Or am I missing something in the mPOINTS suggestion?
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rumbleseat
Champion Author
Winnipeg
Posts:22,925
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Message Posted: Feb 5, 2013 6:32:00 PM
mPoints?
I couldn't advocate a new system that would immediately shut all the Canadian contributors out.
I couldn't advocate a new system that would immediately shut all PC users out.
[Edited by: rumbleseat at 2/5/2013 6:32:45 PM EST]
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matt9978
All-Star Author
St. Louis
Posts:638
Points:382,465
Joined:Dec 2005
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Message Posted: Feb 5, 2013 5:22:01 PM
It would be nice to get more points, but it doesnt really matter to me. Ill report as many as I see regardless.
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Donnerino
Sophomore Author
Maine
Posts:155
Points:249,400
Joined:May 2012
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Message Posted: Feb 5, 2013 3:00:03 PM
Then again, you might have the same problems you say you have now.
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Donnerino
Sophomore Author
Maine
Posts:155
Points:249,400
Joined:May 2012
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Message Posted: Feb 5, 2013 2:59:19 PM
Has anyone looked into an mPoints system vs the current card raffle?
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musicreporter
All-Star Author
San Antonio
Posts:626
Points:133,990
Joined:Dec 2012
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Message Posted: Feb 2, 2013 10:20:44 PM
whatever works.
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MsPeachi747
Sophomore Author
Cleveland
Posts:198
Points:10,430
Joined:Dec 2011
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Message Posted: Feb 2, 2013 12:44:40 PM
Keep it coming!
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MsPeachi747
Sophomore Author
Cleveland
Posts:198
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Message Posted: Feb 2, 2013 12:44:06 PM
Roll on!
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kwzh
Champion Author
San Jose
Posts:20,649
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Message Posted: Feb 2, 2013 12:25:51 AM
Scrapheap writes,
> Yet the app award roll on.
Touche. That could be either because it's both good *and* bad for the site, and they haven't yet worked out how to separate the good parts from the bad parts; or it could be that it's still an experiment in progress.
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TxJeans
Champion Author
Tampa
Posts:3,538
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Message Posted: Feb 1, 2013 7:30:03 PM
What is good and fair for the broad demographics from their various home sites and what is good for any particular site and the global entity do not have to be two totally independent data points.
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Scrapheap
Champion Author
Virginia
Posts:14,546
Points:2,358,530
Joined:Sep 2006
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Message Posted: Feb 1, 2013 8:10:58 AM
kwzh wrote > Ultimately, the real question is whether a change would be good or bad for the *site*, not the *users*. And it seems pretty clear that removing the cap would be bad for the site.
Yet the app award roll on.
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kwzh
Champion Author
San Jose
Posts:20,649
Points:3,683,360
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Message Posted: Feb 1, 2013 3:41:21 AM
People keep bringing up "fairness", but I think that's irrelevant. Fair is whatever the site owners say it is -- and any argument that some change would be unfair to some group can equally well be argued that the lack of it is unfair to the complementary group.
Ultimately, the real question is whether a change would be good or bad for the *site*, not the *users*. And it seems pretty clear that removing the cap would be bad for the site.
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maxstar
Champion Author
Chicago
Posts:18,484
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Message Posted: Feb 1, 2013 12:47:47 AM
I think so CelticHeart. Several have provided the reasoning for point limits on posting prices and provided advice on how to increase the tickets that can be purchased (mainly by maxing out the points allowed every day).
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Gas_Buddy
Champion Author
Maryland
Posts:25,967
Points:3,033,090
Joined:Aug 2004
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Message Posted: Feb 1, 2013 12:45:06 AM
CelticHeart:
"Hasn't this topic been beaten to death?"
Take your choice:
Obviously not.
Apparently not.
Of course not; if it were, this topic wouldn't have been started.
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CelticHeart
Champion Author
Detroit
Posts:138,559
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Message Posted: Jan 31, 2013 10:18:46 PM
Hasn't this topic been beaten to death?
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Bruce1224
Champion Author
Cincinnati
Posts:1,243
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Message Posted: Jan 31, 2013 8:27:39 PM
In part there's a desire for more points because it's human nature to think that more is better. The debate about increasing the limit on how many points per day can be earned is likely to go on forever, but I can see long-term members getting pretty offended if the limit is increased. They've spent years accumulating their mountain of points and it wouldn't seem right to allow newbies to gain disproportionately from a rule change. Also, they'd have to increase the cost of each ticket for the weekly drawings in relation to any change in the limit to earnable points, unless they can increase the pot of money available for the gas card prizes.
I personally would like a higher limit just to be able to track my numbers more easily, but it really doesn't make a difference. One idea could be to revise the awards on the mobile apps to make tracking progress easier, even if it's just the 'reporter' award - maybe put thresholds at 5000 point intervals. These awards are pretty much for personal use - no competition because only one person can access them. In the meantime, it's good to keep posting prices as you see them to pump fresh data to the system.
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TxJeans
Champion Author
Tampa
Posts:3,538
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Message Posted: Jan 31, 2013 8:23:07 PM
I think the last two posts by Scoutmaster and Rumbleseat pretty much sum up the situation.
I just don't understand why folks get so bent out of shape over points. Winning the gas card? That would be one reason for keeping the points to five prices as indicated by Rumbleseat. It is a lottery with chances much like a lottery.
Why do folks need this public validation? You get value from your posts by knowing you are contributing to the value of the site.
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scoutmaster
Champion Author
Pittsburgh
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Message Posted: Jan 31, 2013 10:54:34 AM
Five (5) prices could equal two (2) to five (5) stations depending on how stations post prices on their signs. In your case Donnerino, those 10 stations could equal 10 to 50 prices posted but as you know, you will only get credit for the 1st five (5) you post.
I agree with rumbleseat. Five (5)/day is attainable and keeps the playing field level.
Take advantage of what is available before you ask for more.
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rumbleseat
Champion Author
Winnipeg
Posts:22,925
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Message Posted: Jan 31, 2013 9:29:56 AM
A - EVERYBODY can get credit for 5 prices posted. It would be detrimental to the site to allow high limits as city drivers would have an advantage over country drivers (where we actually need more coverage), truckers would have an advantage over office workers, and taxi and courier drivers in some cities could post 1,000 prices!
B - 5 is attainable for most members, and is a level playing field.
Name-calling is not necessary. We have had this conversation MANY times in the time I have been a member, we will likely have it again in the future. It has not been shown there is value to the site to increase the number of prices we get points for, but it can easily be shown, and this has been explained MANY times in the time I have been a member, how an increase can be detrimental, and no matter WHAT the limit was at, people would not be happy, whether it was 10, 20, 500, or 1,000, somebody would be disadvantaged.
This site is not a gaming site, or a points race, the points are there for fun, and a chance to win a gas card. I have yet to win one, and while winning would be nice, that is not the reason I joined.
Take it from some of us that have been members for some years, changing the limits isn't in the works at the moment.
[Edited by: rumbleseat at 1/31/2013 9:30:26 AM EST]
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MARIOWERX
Champion Author
Vancouver
Posts:15,932
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Message Posted: Jan 31, 2013 9:16:28 AM
Just to calm this down a bit, possibly giving points for 5 stations keeps it real and fair to everyone. We can see from the mobile app. awards that to gain an app.award, posting is abused.
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Donnerino
Sophomore Author
Maine
Posts:155
Points:249,400
Joined:May 2012
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Message Posted: Jan 31, 2013 7:46:40 AM
Scoutmaster, I pass 10 gas stations on my way to work and post as many of them as possible, whenever I can. I've had the app for 2 weeks, and have been posting prices more frequently, though with the app, I can't read news articles, post to a blog, or do all that other crap that you get points for, which I don't really care about.
I post as many as 20 prices a day. I get credit for 5. If you look at my points statistics, you're going to see my limit.
So I'm a user? A user is someone who looks at prices and doesn't post. I post. I'm just looking for better credit for those posts. I'm using MY data to do this from my app, not Gas Prices . COM's data. So YES, I want to see some value for what I'm contributing.
When I view content on The Weather Channel and Dictionary.COM, I get VALUE for what I post.
I haven't asked you to give out a damn penny more each week than you already do. I just want credit for what I post.
So I understand you've had fraud. How about a higher limit? I can't tell you how many times I post to our local sites and if I haven't posted for a day, see them out of line (or even posted incorrectly, like off by a full ten cents).
I'm concientious about my postings. I didn't post this request to be ridiculed by a group of judgemental social editor wannabees.
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Gas_Buddy
Champion Author
Maryland
Posts:25,967
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Message Posted: Jan 30, 2013 10:06:26 PM
fnsbc:
Can you clarify something?
You wrote: "I've been only able to post gas prices for only 2 stations to get points. Before, it was 3, now it's 2."
That seems understandable; you now pass (or see prices for) two gas stations instead of the three gas stations you used to pass. But you then say:
"So i have to remember the last 2 stations i saw prices for but didn't report and report them the next day."
Are you saying that you aren't able to post prices for the gas stations you saw until the next day? Or are you saying that there are other stations you're not posting for, or are you saying that, in order to get points credit, you're posting the prices again the next day?
Sorry, and maybe it's me, but I found your post confusing and just want to make sure I understand correctly what you're saying.
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scoutmaster
Champion Author
Pittsburgh
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Message Posted: Jan 30, 2013 9:56:04 PM
fnsbc seems like another user instead of a contributor. And I agree with TxJeans! If you are posting day old prices, STOP!
[Edited by: scoutmaster at 1/30/2013 9:56:30 PM EST]
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TxJeans
Champion Author
Tampa
Posts:3,538
Points:368,980
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Message Posted: Jan 30, 2013 8:17:35 PM
@Donniero "If I tie 15 knots today, but my computer only shows 5 a day, I've still tied 15 knots. "
So, you have the pride in knowing you tied 15 knots today and helped the others looking for those 15 knots. It doesn't matter that the computer shows 5 knots as long as the 15 knots are there for others to use.
If all you are here for is to get a shot at the lottery for the gas card prizes, you are here for the wrong reason. Your idea would only promote those that don't have 10 stations (since stations often these days only post 1 price on the sign in many areas) cheating if they want to have their ego massaged by seeing their point total climb. And, as you said, you have left many points on the table. So, take the points available on the table before you start worrying about availability of more points. And, make sure those points on the table are not moldy or rotten but are fresh accurate prices.
@fnsbc -"So i have to remember the last 2 stations i saw prices for but didn't report and report them the next day. "
What do you mean? Are you posting prices that are old the next day for points? If so -- get out of here. You are diluting the quality of the data.
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fnsbc
Rookie Author
San Bernardino
Posts:11
Points:88,180
Joined:Jul 2010
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Message Posted: Jan 30, 2013 8:09:47 PM
I've been only able to post gas prices for only 2 stations to get points.
Before, it was 3, now it's 2.
So i have to remember the last 2 stations i saw prices for but didn't report and report them the next day.
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scoutmaster
Champion Author
Pittsburgh
Posts:81,291
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Message Posted: Jan 30, 2013 5:15:26 PM
Well, Donnerino, if you tie 15 knots your computer will show you tied 15 knots. You will only get points for 5 knots but if you look at the knot board to see who tied them you will see your name.
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Gas_Buddy
Champion Author
Maryland
Posts:25,967
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Message Posted: Jan 30, 2013 4:17:19 PM
Mikeyl wrote:
"Would more points help more people to post more often, though? My guess would be yes. So, let's try it for six months and see what happens!"
We already have multiple topics and numerous posts about members posting false prices, members posting false prices for points, members posting prices for non-existent types of fuel at a station, in order to add to their mobile app awards level, and in order to get points to increase their chances of winning the weekly drawing.
You don't think that more ways to get points, allowing more price posts for points, won't increase the problem? And you don't think it would be unfair to those members who post accurate prices for the one or two stations that they see during their daily travels?
If you want to try something, try not giving points for gas price posts, just give points in the "fun" or "innocuous discussion categories". And, instead of indicating the number of message posts in the profile box for message posts, indicate the number of gas prices posts a member has made. And, instead of a total points or 30 day points "high", replace those with the number of total gas price posts a member has made. After all, isn't gas price posting the primary purpose we're here? Either to help our fellow members or take advantage of their price posting help?
Donnerino wrote:
"If I tie 15 knots today, but my computer only shows 5 a day, I've still tied 15 knots."
Yes, but (from one scout master to another), if you're in a "Who ties it the fastest" contest, and you win the first three heats, and you win the final; you're only getting credit for winning one contest, and you're only getting one prize.
[Edited by: Gas_Buddy at 1/30/2013 4:19:06 PM EST]
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Donnerino
Sophomore Author
Maine
Posts:155
Points:249,400
Joined:May 2012
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Message Posted: Jan 30, 2013 4:03:52 PM
Okay Scoutmaster. Let me put this in terms you can understand (from one Scoutmaster to another). If I tie 15 knots today, but my computer only shows 5 a day, I've still tied 15 knots.
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Mikeyl
Champion Author
Cleveland
Posts:5,152
Points:1,185,020
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Message Posted: Jan 30, 2013 3:44:59 PM
I know I'd be up another million or so points if this would happen.
The point of this site is to offer the most up-to-date pricing available at any station in the United States (for the most part).
So, post away!
I don't care about the points. I don't buy the raffle tickets. Whatever. Contests are generally worthless and are focused towards the weaker-minded to get them involved.
Post prices because you feel the duty to update this site since you are using this site. I look for lower gas prices here so I should be supporting the site by posting prices every time I am out and about and go by a gas station.
Would more points help more people to post more often, though? My guess would be yes. So, let's try it for six months and see what happens!
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scoutmaster
Champion Author
Pittsburgh
Posts:81,291
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Message Posted: Jan 30, 2013 7:57:04 AM
"Sure, I've left points on the table, but I've posted way more prices than my daily limit."
The math doesn't support your statement Donnerino. Based on your current point total you have left roughly 20,000 price points on the table.
Take advantage of what is available before you ask for more.
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Donnerino
Sophomore Author
Maine
Posts:155
Points:249,400
Joined:May 2012
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Message Posted: Jan 30, 2013 7:40:56 AM
MaxStar - Sure, I've left points on the table, but I've posted way more prices than my daily limit. The fact that I don't like to waste my time in the forums the way you do has no bearing on my comment regarding gas price postings.
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kwzh
Champion Author
San Jose
Posts:20,649
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Message Posted: Jan 30, 2013 12:45:14 AM
I'm pretty sure that "giving people a better shot for posting more frequently" was meant to be parsed as "the people who post more frequently should be given a better shot (at winning the prize)". (I happen to disagree with the sentiment, as noted earlier; but let's try to all be addressing the same question.)
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JMW1942
All-Star Author
Michigan
Posts:571
Points:406,970
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Message Posted: Jan 29, 2013 5:59:19 PM
I don't have a problem with the five point limit at all. When we are on a trip we post every price we see to keep all prices up to date. When ever I go to town I always update prices even if done in the last hour.
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CelticHeart
Champion Author
Detroit
Posts:138,559
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Message Posted: Jan 29, 2013 9:56:49 AM
Post all you want, post 100 prices a day, as long as they are accurate.
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scoutmaster
Champion Author
Pittsburgh
Posts:81,291
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Message Posted: Jan 28, 2013 4:57:18 PM
A better shot for posting more frequently??? There is nothing preventing anyone from posting as many prices as they want!
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Scrapheap
Champion Author
Virginia
Posts:14,546
Points:2,358,530
Joined:Sep 2006
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Message Posted: Jan 28, 2013 3:48:11 PM
Giving people a better shot for posting more frequently? You can report as many gas prices as you want under the current system.
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Donnerino
Sophomore Author
Maine
Posts:155
Points:249,400
Joined:May 2012
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Message Posted: Jan 28, 2013 3:11:33 PM
I like those ideas. I'm not proposing that Gas Prices gives out more prizes, or spends a darn penny more on awards. Just giving people a better shot for posting more frequently. Sounds fair to me.
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Gas_Buddy
Champion Author
Maryland
Posts:25,967
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Message Posted: Jan 27, 2013 9:22:27 PM
OKCGirl:
See the moderator's posts in the following thread:
Moderator information regarding Top Spotters
Does that answer your question?
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OKCGirl
All-Star Author
Oklahoma City
Posts:825
Points:244,215
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Message Posted: Jan 27, 2013 9:11:20 PM
Where can I find an explanation on the new top spotter for each gas station is calculated?
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scoutmaster
Champion Author
Pittsburgh
Posts:81,291
Points:3,253,470
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Message Posted: Jan 27, 2013 5:08:22 PM
I dunno rumbleseat. It looks initially in that post you are endorsing more points but sorta back down at the end. If I misunderstood, sorry. At best, yours was a confusing post.
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rumbleseat
Champion Author
Winnipeg
Posts:22,925
Points:3,530,290
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Message Posted: Jan 27, 2013 4:30:34 PM
Again, scout, nowhere have I EVER, in all the instances people have clamoured for more points for price postings, suggested more points guarantee responsible price posting. Where the heck did you get that idea? I have NEVER wanted to increase the number of prices one gets points for, for the simple reason that we have always had cheaters, and more points would increase them. My stance on that has NEVER changed.
As I said, you cherry-picked one phrase from my post, one phrase from the middle of a sentence, and have started an argument with me over a stance I have never taken.
My post CLEARLY states allowing more points for price posts would be detrimental.
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TxJeans
Champion Author
Tampa
Posts:3,538
Points:368,980
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Message Posted: Jan 27, 2013 11:29:24 AM
Scrap -
"TxJeans - Rumbleseat's comment was directed at you. Look carefully for a different users name. "
He said "Scout". I would assume it was directed at scout, and I was indicating I understood him...not admitting to cherry picking which I don't feel I did. I reread and still assume he was referring to Scout as the cherry picker.
If he has a problem about what I supposedly cherry picked from him when I essentially agreed that we need more people posting not more prices (for points) then it will just have to be his problem.
Rumpleseat said:
"What we need, especially in the rural areas, is more people posting prices, Increasing the number of prices for points will increase the number of prices posted, mostly in the urban areas. Some posters in areas with only 1 or 2 stations would just go away, realizing it was now a points race, nothing more, nothing less. Information in rural areas would decrease, and information in urban areas would become suspect. "
Let me break down what I understood.
1 In rural areas there are not enough people posting prices, and less stations available to post.
2 Increasing number of prices for points will increase the number of postings in URBAN areas - since more folks are posting and see more stations that they CAN post beyond 5.
3 In RURAL areas there may only be 2 stations that might not post all grades. It is hard in some rural areas for folks to make the current FIVE per day.
4 something many have expressed is that increasing over 5 just temps some to repost what someone posted even if they have not confirmed it is still valid to get the additional points.
In summary, I think both Rumbleseat and I agree that increasing the number of price posts will likely decrease the quality of price data than improve it. It is a bad idea.
[Edited by: TxJeans at 1/27/2013 11:30:17 AM EST]
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Scrapheap
Champion Author
Virginia
Posts:14,546
Points:2,358,530
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Message Posted: Jan 26, 2013 6:05:27 PM
TxJeans - Rumbleseat's comment was directed at you. Look carefully for a different users name.
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scoutmaster
Champion Author
Pittsburgh
Posts:81,291
Points:3,253,470
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Message Posted: Jan 26, 2013 5:43:28 PM
Yes we do need more people responsibly reporting prices, rumbleseat. But more points doesn't guarantee responsible posting. I would rather have responsible accurate posting than a bunch of people posting junk.
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TxJeans
Champion Author
Tampa
Posts:3,538
Points:368,980
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Message Posted: Jan 26, 2013 3:55:58 PM
rumbleseat - I understood you. In an urban area increasing the number of updates that earn points wouldn't make as significant blip on the false posting for points that it would in smaller areas/rural areas. Regardless, it is still a bad idea. I suspect they chose the 5 updates cut off considering the ability for most posters to reach that goal with out resorting to cheating. But, in rural areas, even 5 updates might be hard to obtain.
Donnerino's and traffic-cop's suggestions would be detrimental in the same way the stupid APPS AWARDS are detrimental. And the programming changes would be better used to address more critical issues such as linking the price posting to the MSL coding for the station, and a durable flag (oops, did I say that out loud again - bad me) for dual (cash/credit) stations and dual price fields for cash/credit, and adding other fuel types, or many other more useful enhancements.
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rumbleseat
Champion Author
Winnipeg
Posts:22,925
Points:3,530,290
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Message Posted: Jan 26, 2013 1:35:21 PM
I shouldn't have to explain simple English to somebody who disagrees with me based on a few cherry-picked words.
Bottom line, we need more people posting prices, not just more prices. Please read my whole post scout, instead of just disagreeing with a cherry-picked phrase.
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