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Author Topic: Odd behavior of one particular post. Back to Topics
CampKohler

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Message Posted: Jan 16, 2014 12:59:26 AM

Movrshakr's post of Jan 14th in his Suggest a GasBuddy improvement topic, "New search criteria," is the only reply that I can find in the category (and one other category) that does the following: When you scroll the reply to the left, the text the entire topic remains locked to the screen and only the reply text scrolls for about 22 characters, whereupon the entire topic then begins to scroll. Normally the reply text doesn't scroll; only the entire topic (which, of course includes the reply text) scrolls.

What is special about this one reply that causes this? I thought the single period at its beginning might have something to do with it, but a test reply couldn't duplicate this. This has been observed for two days using Safari on an iPhone 3s. No other testing has been done. Does it happen on a PC? With safari or other browsers?
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CampKohler
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Message Posted: Apr 23, 2014 6:00:39 PM

Re: "text deleted": I haven't nailed everything down, but I have come fairly close to make it meaningful when working with long URLs. I have incorporated my latest research in the rewritten link guide. (I'll work on it some more when I become more amenable to tediousness. Anyone else's research on this would be welcome. [hint])
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GoGoGoodyear
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Message Posted: Apr 22, 2014 8:21:28 PM


@CK:
Your tests appear to have discovered the same thing I noted when looking at this topic again a few minutes ago.

Based on certain rules in the style sheet for the forum pages, some lines of text are not wrapped to the window width. This results in a horizontal scroll bar appearing at the end of the topic reply that contains the unwrappable long line.

This is also why I couldn't see a problem in most of the examples, since many unwrappable lines in a desktop browser at 1024x768 don't exceed window width like on a smartphone browser due to the narrower screen.

Of the examples provided in this topic, the reply by TxJeans on 12/20/2013 in topic "visitor posting" and some of your tests in JFF have the horizontal scroll bar at the end of each reply which contains an unwrappable long line. Other replies don't.

In every browser I have used to look at these examples the reply itself had the horizontal scroll bar, not the entire browser window. If the width of the browser was reduced to the point that nothing could be displayed without scrolling horizontally, another scroll bar appeared at the bottom of the browser's window. Using that scroll bar moved the entire window contents left/right, and using the scroll bar at the end of a reply containing an unwrappable long line moved only that reply left/right. However the entire browser window needed to be scrolled to the left to see the end of the unwrappable line after the reply's scroll bar was used to move the reply to the left.

The browser's behavior you describe on the smartphone in question is similar to the browser behavior I see while typing this response on a desktop machine except for horizontal or vertical scrolling, ie. the number of lines in this entire response exceed the window height, so a vertical scroll bar has appeared at the right edge of the edit window. There is also a vertical scroll bar at the right edge of the browser's window due to this topic having more content than the height of the browser. Using the scroll wheel on the mouse, if I hover in the edit window and scroll up/down, first only the edit window scrolls. When the edit window reaches it's upper or lower limit the entire browser window starts to scroll in the same direction. This seems normal, at least in windows.

The difference apparently, is that the smartphone browser doesn't display two separate scroll bars, one for the unwrappable section and another for the entire window.

Unless the developers step in and tell us what the criteria are, we will probably never find all the special conditions that cause a line to not wrap to the window.

Likewise we will never know the rules for how long a URL can be before it is mangled by "text deleted" upon posting.

[Edited by: GoGoGoodyear at 4/22/2014 8:26:54 PM EST]
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CampKohler
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Message Posted: Apr 22, 2014 6:59:37 PM

Well, think we can conclude that it may be normal for the browser on the one device. That is to say, the reaction of the browser to long strings has more to do with the browser than it does with GBO peculiarities, so there is probably nothing for GBO to do except to add the phrase, "Thar be dragons here!" to the FAQ.

There are lots of rules operating in the background on the site. Long strings may just be deleted at post time. However, this can be interfered with; the strings can be broken up with ampersands and other special characters, some of which derail the "text deleted" reaction of the forum. Unless that is just fortuitous, somebody, somewhere, has a list of just exactly does what to what, but we will likely never see it.

Here's one for you I discovered while testing: Inserting an ampersand in this Apr 22, 2014 3:23:19 PM msg in this test topic resulted in a scrolling bar within the msg when viewed with FF on a PC, but NOT IN SAFARI ON THE IPHONE! Further, the msg, when viewed with Safari on the iPhone did not even result in the scrolling behavior that prompted this topic; you simply couldn't see the end of the msg that went beyond right margin of the msg box. So it is the opposite, getting no scrolling when you need it. Losing access to data on the iPhone that you can get on a PC would be a problem. Perhaps we can come up with a method of ensuring that doesn't happen.

I have learned that it would take a lot of testing time to figure this all out, and, so, I doubt I will. Suffice it to say that long strings may result in unusual viewing experiences, at least for Safari on the iPhone. (I can't put Safari on the PC I am using at the moment, but it would be interesting to see if it works the same as on the iPhone. Who knows, every browser may react to long strings differently.)
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TxJeans
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Message Posted: Apr 22, 2014 7:41:55 AM

Sounds like normal behavior then to allow scrolling.
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CampKohler
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Message Posted: Apr 22, 2014 2:45:15 AM

I think you have hit on it or very close to it. It may not be so much that a URL is involved per se, but that the URL is a long string that the software does not want to break up into segments that would form a page narrow enough that no scrolling would be required. My theory is that on the rare occasion that a long string comes along, the software accommodates it by allowing scrolling of the msg that contains it.

I just found another on—Tony's Apr 21 post in More info for travelers topic. Again there is a string longer than the width of other msgs in the topic as viewed on Safari. This is all tedious on the iPhone, but I'll be at a PC tomorrow, and I will try to pin things down, else it will take a lot more tediousness to do so.

Thanks for your insight.
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LarryMarg
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Message Posted: Apr 19, 2014 12:18:15 PM

> I gave the category, topic, and post date , which is the best i could do. The lack of link was not out of avoiding bother, but out of ignorance; I have no idea how to link to a specific post.

Linking to the topic wold save time for anyone trying to reproduce this, then they'd only have to find the correct post rather than having to drill down from further up the hierarchy. E.g.,
Topic: New search criteria
Topic: visitor posting

> What is special about this one reply that causes this?

I note that both posts include a URL; to me, that seems more likely to be related to the problem than a leading period (although both posts include that, as well).

Here's the link portion from the first post. (If that doesn't reproduce the problem, you could try adding that and the leading periods to a JFF post and see if it's the combination - or post the entirety of one of those posts to a JFF topic, and if you reproduce it with that, start cutting out bits until the problem goes away.)
&area=Town1&area=Town2&area=Town3{AND}zip=39999{AND}station=Shell
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CampKohler
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Message Posted: Apr 18, 2014 5:55:26 PM

Latest on the problem:

1. Confirmed problem using app (hereinafter ✓).
2. Updated IOS (6.1.3 to 6.1.6).
3. ✓
4. Updated iPhone app (V1.26.1375 to V2.0.2)
5. ✓
6. Tried FF on full site by zooming until only a portion of the msg in question is visible in hopes of getting scrolling action and thus duplicating problem, but no joy.
7. Got screen shots of both example problems and posted here.
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CampKohler
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Message Posted: Feb 21, 2014 1:31:00 AM

Sloop: The problem was not "one time;" I just tested it and it is reproduceable today.

I found another occurance, namely, TxJean's reply of Dec 20th in the Visitor Posting topic in this category. I am adding this just for the record.

I will be upgrading to an iPhone 4, and it will be interesting to see if the problem is reproduceable using the latest app and O.S.


[Edited by: CampKohler at 2/21/2014 1:32:51 AM EST]
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sloopfoot
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Message Posted: Feb 1, 2014 9:09:16 AM

From what I can see this is really not an issue and it appears to be something that happened one time to ck.
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GoGoGoodyear
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Message Posted: Jan 28, 2014 10:03:05 PM


I meant as video... of course one can screen capture. I should have been clearer on that in my last post.

I believe capturing a running video of what the screen is doing requires installing a program that does not come with the device, a potential way to muddy the waters when troubleshooting a software problem.
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bytebug
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Message Posted: Jan 28, 2014 3:03:01 AM

>> device that does not have the intrinsic ability to capture it's own display output

What gives you the idea that an iPhone can't capture its own display output? It can do so trivially.

[How to Take a Screenshot on Your iPhone]

[Edited by: bytebug at 1/28/2014 3:07:18 AM EST]
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TxJeans
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Message Posted: Jan 28, 2014 12:12:32 AM

GoGo - I am not questioning your suggestion on HOW he could get the information nor taking issue if anyone wants to investigate. (I haven't seen CK post that video either.) It was more to the statement that CK made that he had to "meetup" with a member because we don't believe him. It is not that I don't believe that he saw what he saw, it is just that I don't feel it is significant after a number of folks have not been able to reproduce it on a wide variety of devices and OS versions.

It is just my opinion that it is a waste of time to worry further about investigating this "oddity" since no one after more than a week has been able to replicate this oddity that CK discovered on an OLD device running old software. Several of us have tried.

CK has been known to go looking for obscure issues of the software to report upon in detail and at least once the MODS commented on him withholding information and misdirecting the membership on a description of a problem with the FSL.

I am stating MY opinion after having actually tested to see if I could reproduce the oddity (unlike others that didn't even bother reporting any results of their testing but jump on anyone that disagrees with CK's analysis of the importance of this find).

Since it has been over a week and no one has been able to reproduce it, I see it as one of those things that is at seems to be a rare occurrence that is a minor irritant. CK even admitted he did not think any of us could reproduce it. But if you want to help chase a one off, go for it, I am not stopping you.

I was just asking what you expect to learn from documenting what CK said he saw (which I never said he didn't see) on his old device that CK hasn't already told us about the problem, or what significance it would be considering it doesn't appear to happen on other posts/threads even for CK, nor with that thread for many other devices and versions.

At least you contributed something to the thread, unlike someone else that likes to complain if anyone dares to disagree with CK.

Maybe the MODS will weigh in if they know what caused this apparently isolated oddity of the forum so we can put this issue to rest.
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GoGoGoodyear
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Message Posted: Jan 27, 2014 11:14:57 PM


TxJeans wrote:
"GoGo -- what does it matter if he videos it or
meets up? It appears to be unique to his old
system..."

You seem to be taking issue with anyone addressing the OP's error by suggesting that because the error reported by the OP has no merit I and others are wasting time and bytes trying to find a solution.

I was addressing a technical issue with a suggestion of how to capture a displayed error from a device that does not have the intrinsic ability to capture it's own display output and save it to a file. You will note that in the same post I acknowledged that "Either way, this will turn out to be difficult to reproduce if it's a bug in an older version of the OS or browser."

The fact that the error reported by the OP can't be reproduced by others or may turn out to be insignificant doesn't change the validity of my technical suggestion.
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Scrapheap
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Message Posted: Jan 26, 2014 2:31:10 PM

@TxJeans - More accurately, I object to people who attack and try to control people who start legitimate threads in this forum.

Yes, to an extent you addressed this thread but so did sarasotasingle in this thread. I would hardly consider his post to be apprpriate however.

[Edited by: Scrapheap at 1/26/2014 2:30:33 PM EST]
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TxJeans
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Message Posted: Jan 22, 2014 9:10:15 PM

Scrapheap - I tested what CK described on two devices. YOU only attack others. I contributed to the content of the thread, and YOU attack others.
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Scrapheap
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Message Posted: Jan 22, 2014 11:56:16 AM

TxJeans wrote > If they want us to continue to investigate, I suggest they action the thread, or if not close it.

Why is it necessary for the moderators to do anything? This thread would be dead by now if not for the pack of CK stalkers. If the problem does not interest you, why look at this thread at all? Wouldn't this thread just die on its own?
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TxJeans
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Message Posted: Jan 22, 2014 7:42:56 AM

GoGo -- what does it matter if he videos it or meets up? It appears to be unique to his old system, and a one off at that as he has not been able to reproduce the problem in a test post. It is a curiosity, but not much more.

Several members have tried to reproduce the issue on many current systems w/out success. The thread is here, for GBO and the developers if they have the desire to chase this low incident, low risk, problem that seems to only affect CK (he hasn't even bothered to report if it was a problem on the public browser he uses at the library), they know where to come to find CK to ask more details.

If they want us to continue to investigate, I suggest they action the thread, or if not close it.

Seriously, since it doesn't seem to be bothering others, and doesn't prevent the site from being used by even the OP, I would assume it would be relegated to the bottom of the heap for investigation as a possible minor irritation.



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GoGoGoodyear
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Message Posted: Jan 22, 2014 4:04:01 AM


"...I'm going to have to meet up with some
member, demonstrate the symptom and let
him tell you what he sees."

CK, with another camera you could photograph or video the display misbehaving and post that somewhere. I would have suggested to use a screen capture prog but when troubleshooting software issues the last thing one wants to do is add more variables to the mix.

Either way, this will turn out to be difficult to reproduce if it's a bug in an older version of the OS or browser.
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bytebug
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Message Posted: Jan 21, 2014 5:31:40 AM

>> Alright, alright, I'm going to have to meet up with some member, demonstrate
>> the symptom and let him tell you what he sees.

You don't get it. It's not a problem with the website — it's a problem with your phone. Apple has stopped supporting those versions of Safari and iOS. Anybody, with a little effort, can find bugs in obsolete software.

Given that nobody can duplicate the problem with a current browser, we must assume that the issue has since been corrected. If you can duplicate the issue using a current browser, and document how to reproduce the problem so that someone else can see the problem for themselves, then you have an issue that would be of interest to pursue.
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CampKohler
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Message Posted: Jan 21, 2014 12:59:54 AM

Alright, alright, I'm going to have to meet up with some member, demonstrate the symptom and let him tell you what he sees.
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sloopfoot
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Message Posted: Jan 20, 2014 12:01:45 PM

I didnt notice anything unusual in that topic, either. It makes me think either Camp doesnt know what he is doing or he is purposely trying to create a problem when it doesnt exist.

Scrapheap why do you see the need to attack others?
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bytebug
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Message Posted: Jan 19, 2014 9:11:49 PM

>> What did CK say that makes you think he invoked abnormal behavior?

"My philosophy here is that if a bug reveals itself by some abnormal behavior…"
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Scrapheap
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Message Posted: Jan 19, 2014 8:27:31 PM

Gas_Buddy wrote > Maybe I'm not understanding the problem but it seems to me (and I'm computer illiterate so take this with a grain of salt) that you can probably find a lot of things "wrong" if you invoke abnormal behavior.

What did CK say that makes you think he invoked abnormal behavior?
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EZExit
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Message Posted: Jan 19, 2014 6:05:11 PM

I tried to duplicate the problem on a Dell 386 running Windows 3.1, using a POTS connection method, and I cannot find any problems. I suggest that you return your operating system to its default factory settings, and then refrain from making any changes unless you are in full understanding of what affect each change might have. This post compliments the thoughts of Bytebug and TxJeans.
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Gas_Buddy
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Message Posted: Jan 19, 2014 4:34:02 PM


Following bytebug's post, I'm confused about the "My philosophy here is that if a bug reveals itself by some abnormal behavior..."

Maybe I'm not understanding the problem but it seems to me (and I'm computer illiterate so take this with a grain of salt) that you can probably find a lot of things "wrong" if you invoke abnormal behavior. Or don't I understand the issue? Not that an explanation is due me, but if (as bytebug suggested) if you're having a problem with an obsolete version of software on an obsolete version of an operating system, isn't that pretty much like using the current Word for Windows on an MS DOS system or trying to open a Wordstar or VisiCalc file and not expecting to have a problem?
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bytebug
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Message Posted: Jan 19, 2014 5:56:47 AM

>> I have done my part to report it.

You've reported an issue with an obsolete version of software on an obsolete version of the operating system. Apple is unlikely to respond to requests to fix it.
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CampKohler
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Message Posted: Jan 19, 2014 2:07:08 AM

Tx: My philosophy here is that if a bug reveals itself by some abnormal behavior, it may make that bug easily found and thus prevent other misbehavior, the cause of which may not be so apparent. The fact that the symptom I observe is a small problem or even none at all is merely a side affect. If you disagree with that philosophy, I don't really care; it's up to GBO to determine whether it's worth their time to unravel this particular thread (no pun intended) and see what it leads to. I have done my part to report it.

I did not say I could not link to a topic. Your reply of the 17th sought a link to "the problem," the problem being a particular post (and not the topic as a whole, or even any other part of the topic), and I don't know how to link to a particular post. But if you know how to do that, please spill the beans.

As far as being a bother to me is concerned, it's not; the subject behavior does't even rise to the level of annoyance, minor or otherwise.

BTW, it's still there.



[Edited by: CampKohler at 1/19/2014 2:07:38 AM EST]
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Scrapheap
Champion Author Virginia

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Message Posted: Jan 18, 2014 6:24:11 PM

Hey, I was offering some advice so you didn't make yourself look small and foolish in the future. I am having a happy day thanks.

[Edited by: Scrapheap at 1/18/2014 6:22:52 PM EST]
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TxJeans
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Message Posted: Jan 18, 2014 3:56:01 PM

Scrap, if my post bothers you, you put ME on ignore.
Have a happy day Scrap.
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Scrapheap
Champion Author Virginia

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Message Posted: Jan 18, 2014 2:59:05 PM

@TxJeans - Maybe you should put CK on ignore.
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TxJeans
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Message Posted: Jan 18, 2014 6:20:56 AM

@CK

<<<<I want to thank all those who tried to reproduce this. I had a feeling you wouldn't be able to, and for all I know, even another 3s user might not be able to. I just checked it again and it still does it. I posted this in case GBO thinks a bug that could be stomped should be stomped. You can never tell what other troubles it might lead to.>>>>
CK, the fact that this is 1) rare instance, and 2) only a minor annoyance (to you- probably wouldn't bother me and most others if it is a rare occurrence as even you suggested) why bother? <<<"BB: I gave the category, topic, and post date , which is the best i could do. The lack of link was not out of avoiding bother, but out of ignorance; I have no idea how to link to a specific post. As your GasBuddy age is six years longer than mine, perhaps you'd be kind enough to show me how it's done.">>>

Maybe instead of spending so much time documenting minor annoyances and looking for problems (and creating them and leaving out details to get more comments as you have done in the past), you should take some time to learn the site? How hard is it to link to a topic? Seriously? Come on CK, you can come up with a better excuse -- unless it is too hard on your iOS?

<<<"BTW, "...problems where none exist" seems to imply that I am making up the symptom described. Do you really believe I would go to this trouble to create a malfunction that would never be experienced by anyone? I suppose I could meet up with another GasBuddy and demonstrate it, whereupon he could post his confirmation. (But of course we could be in cahoots with each other to purpetrate a monstrous conspiracy to undermine the public's confidence in the integrity of the GasBuddy system. What is truth, anyway?)">>>

No, it is not so much that you made up the symptom you described (but you do have a habit of sometimes redirecting/misdirecting), but that this odd behavior of one post that you couldn't replicate and no one else is reporting and is only a minor annoyance at best is typical of your past history of seeming to look for one offs and anything you can post as a bug. Maybe you need to apply somewhere as a software tester and make some money over your obsession about little issues on a FREE site.
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bytebug
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Message Posted: Jan 18, 2014 4:41:20 AM

>> I posted this in case GBO thinks a bug that could be stomped should be stomped.

Why should any effort be put into tracking down an issue that only occurs for one user, and is likely due to user error or misconfiguration? I suggest you add this to your wiki of imaginary problems that nobody cares about.
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CampKohler
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Message Posted: Jan 18, 2014 1:18:49 AM

I want to thank all those who tried to reproduce this. I had a feeling you wouldn't be able to, and for all I know, even another 3s user might not be able to. I just checked it again and it still does it. I posted this in case GBO thinks a bug that could be stomped should be stomped. You can never tell what other troubles it might lead to.

jrsva: You are correct; I meant scroll to the right (the finger moves to the left).

BB: I gave the category, topic, and post date , which is the best i could do. The lack of link was not out of avoiding bother, but out of ignorance; I have no idea how to link to a specific post. As your GasBuddy age is six years longer than mine, perhaps you'd be kind enough to show me how it's done.

BTW, "...problems where none exist" seems to imply that I am making up the symptom described. Do you really believe I would go to this trouble to create a malfunction that would never be experienced by anyone? I suppose I could meet up with another GasBuddy and demonstrate it, whereupon he could post his confirmation. (But of course we could be in cahoots with each other to purpetrate a monstrous conspiracy to undermine the public's confidence in the integrity of the GasBuddy system. What is truth, anyway?)



[Edited by: CampKohler at 1/18/2014 1:20:05 AM EST]
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Gas_Buddy
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Message Posted: Jan 17, 2014 2:31:19 PM

Include me in the "I don't see this problem..." or "where this is a problem" group. But I'm using both an iPhone 4S and Lg G2 android phone with the current software, a netbook with Windows 8 using Google Chrome and Firefox, and a Windows 7 laptop with gurrent versions of Chrome, Firefox, and Internet Explorer, not using Safari on an iPhone 3S.

Maybe if it's just (as said in the original post) "this one reply", maybe it's nothing to worry about. I agree it seems like looking for a solution to something that's not really an issue. But, again, I'm using different equipment and different programs than the person having the "problem".
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RichWLIN
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Message Posted: Jan 17, 2014 10:37:03 AM

Link for bytebug
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bytebug
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Message Posted: Jan 17, 2014 8:14:15 AM

Since the OP couldn't be bothered to post a link to the problem, I can't be bothered to look at how the page displays on my collection of machines. It is also reassuring to hear reports that make this again look like the OP is looking for problems where none exist.
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TxJeans
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Message Posted: Jan 17, 2014 6:51:39 AM

No problem on desktop with FF. Made my window narrow to get the horizontal scroll bar and it worked just fine.

Since it is not a widespread problem (is the only reply that I can find in the category (and one other category)) and so far seems limited to CK's iPhone 3 it is a curiosity and not something to lose sleep over. Yawn.

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GoGoGoodyear
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Message Posted: Jan 17, 2014 3:04:46 AM


I was unable to duplicate this problem on two desktops, with several versions of FF / XP and 1 version of SeaMonkey / Linux.

In my testing the display cannot be scrolled horizontal, only vertical because there is no horiz scrollbar. My display is always set to 1024 x 768 and I believe I would need to reduce it to 800 x 600 or less to cause horiz scrollbars to appear.

To the best of my recollection I have never run across any GB page that did not fit in a 1024 x 768 window so that it would require horizontal scrolling.

NOTE: always using NoScript and Adblock+ here, so it is possible that it's blocking some oversize ad that if displayed, could take up more horizontal screen space and create the need to scroll horiz.
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jrsva
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Message Posted: Jan 17, 2014 1:48:52 AM

“When you scroll the reply to the left . . . .”

How do you scroll to the left? I can scroll that topic up and down, in which case it behaves just like any other topic — the whole thing moves up and down as a unit. I use the mouse wheel to scroll up and down but see no way to scroll right to left. Firefox and Win7 Pro.

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