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Author Topic: Does Anyone Use K & N Airfilters? Back to Topics
fivetexans

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Dallas

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Message Posted: Apr 9, 2011 10:53:28 AM

Sorry if this has already been discussed somewhere else. I couldn't find a way to search the forum (I'm still a rookie author).

I was going to fork out $50 for K & N air filter to try and improve gas mileage and HP... but mostly for gas mileage. With the price of oil going over $112 a barrel yesterday, the $4.00 per gallon of gas is going to be coming soon. So, I'm just looking a squeaking out another few miles per tank, spread out over the course of a year or so.

Was just looking for some input from anyone else who has used this brand.

Thanks,

Rich
REPLIES (newest first) Topic is locked
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DHIGAJ
All-Star Author Toronto

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Message Posted: Jul 19, 2013 11:21:21 PM

NO
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FrankLee1
All-Star Author Minnesota

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Message Posted: Jul 19, 2013 9:25:15 AM

I bow to you, Master Of The Ridiculous.
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ldheinz
Champion Author Chicago

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Message Posted: Jul 19, 2013 7:55:10 AM

FrankLee1, I guess that when logic just isn't in your playbook, resorting to classic rhetorical fallacies like Appeal to Ridicule is all you've got.
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FrankLee1
All-Star Author Minnesota

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Message Posted: Jul 19, 2013 5:57:12 AM

I use K&N filters in my coffee maker. I get my coffee quicker and it has more octane in it- I get more pep in my step! *thumbup*
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dassfg
Champion Author Fort Worth

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Message Posted: Jul 10, 2013 10:07:22 AM

Have in the past on 3/4 and 1 ton trucks - they do help performance and fuel economy
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Boyrr
Champion Author Allentown

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Message Posted: Jul 10, 2013 9:15:46 AM

there good filters, but claims of fuel savings is a stretch
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d_clark
Champion Author Grand Rapids

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Message Posted: Jul 9, 2013 6:15:45 PM

no
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ldheinz
Champion Author Chicago

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Message Posted: Jul 9, 2013 3:32:16 PM

forresj - "How can anyone accurately measure 1 or 2 mpg improvement when driving behavior is realistically so erratic. "

I can measure MPG to tenths of an MPG using my Bluetooth OBD II reader and the "Torque" Android App for my Smartphone. It's fun to check and get feedback on your driving techniques, and it's great to verify performance increases from various performance modifications. I also like that when performance drops I know about it and can fix a problem before it gets bad.

I currently get 32-33 mpg at 72 mph with the A/C on from my 96 Ford Taurus with 282,000 miles. At 55 mph I get 38-40 mpg.
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Bud76
Champion Author San Bernardino

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Message Posted: Jul 9, 2013 2:50:02 PM

yes
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RdHogg
Champion Author Houston

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Message Posted: Jul 9, 2013 10:59:21 AM

yes, have for years
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ldheinz
Champion Author Chicago

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Message Posted: Jul 9, 2013 8:54:12 AM

forresj - "Gee I guess your "engine vacuum" theory is BS....that's a shame. I'm sure you worked really hard thinking about it. "

You mean that since your quotes confirm that it's true that means that it's false? Strange reasoning there. You do know what engine vacuum is, right?

Monitoring engine vacuum is a simple MPG gauge. When I'm driving for mileage I display it and actual calculated GPS MPG gauges on my smartphone.
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forresj
Champion Author Wilmington

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Message Posted: Jul 9, 2013 8:13:46 AM

Gee I guess your "engine vacuum" theory is BS....that's a shame. I'm sure you worked really hard thinking about it.
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ldheinz
Champion Author Chicago

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Message Posted: Jul 8, 2013 12:25:12 AM

forresj, do you realize that "more air" is needed to "increase pressure", right? They are essentially the same thing. The MAP (Manifold Air Pressure) sensor reads engine vacuum, which is less when you have a less restrictive intake system, which lowers pumping losses, increasing engine efficiency, as Houckster said.

There is nothing in what you quoted that conflicts in any way with what Houckster or I have said.
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forresj
Champion Author Wilmington

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Message Posted: Jul 8, 2013 12:11:42 AM

I found this from an K&N website, image that. Increase pressure and not more air is the reason for increased HP. So, Idheinz, you're explanation is pretty much BS.

http://www.knfilters.com/faq.htm#7

7. Can a K&N filter give my engine too much air flow?

No. An engine can only draw in a certain volume of air depending on the engine's size (measured by such things as bore, stroke and number of cylinders). Vehicles are designed to accommodate large changes in air pressure so they can operate at sea level or at an altitude of 14,000 feet. Engine computers adjust the amount of fuel required as a result of changes in air pressure (density). Air filter restriction when the filter is new and especially as the filter loads with dust will result in lower air pressure and availability similar to being at a high elevation. High-flow air filters that were invented by K&N were designed to reduce the work necessary to pull air through the filter and to increase air pressure. Increased air pressure is one of the key elements in producing more power.


[Edited by: forresj at 7/8/2013 12:16:43 AM EST]
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Houckster
Champion Author Atlanta

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Message Posted: Jul 7, 2013 12:10:05 PM

IDHEINZ writes: Lowering the intake air restriction will allow more air into the cylinder and therefore increase power.
______
Not wishing to fuel the fires of dissension any further, my reason for using K&N filters is to reduce engine pumping loss. I suspect the engine will get nearly the same amount of air with any filter but a filter that can filter air more quickly means the engine has to work less to get the air it needs. The benefit derived is related to how hard the car is driven. If one is driving for MPG, the effect may not be that great. OTOH, it may be quite valuable for when maximum engine power is occasionally needed.

K&N's filter comments

Cars Direct: Advantages and Disadvantages of K&N filters
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ldheinz
Champion Author Chicago

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Message Posted: Jul 7, 2013 9:22:45 AM

Whereas, forresj, you're talking ignorance. Ever heard of engine vacuum? The cylinder does not fill with air to atmospheric pressure, as there's not enough time. Lowering the intake air restriction will allow more air into the cylinder and therefore increase power. It's the resulting increase in throttle response that's my favorite advantage of K&N air filters.
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forresj
Champion Author Wilmington

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Message Posted: Jul 7, 2013 8:17:11 AM

K&N does not increase air intake in the combustion cylinder. Air is sucked in during the downward stroke of the cylinder. The volume of air is dependent on cylinder displacement. So, you're telling me that K&N filters will miraculously increase cylinder displacement? Or maybe you're saying that a K&N filter is able to filter more oxygen into the cylinder?

The only way you can get more air into the cylinder is with a turbo charger or supercharger. Both compresses air into a fixed volume of space. That's how you get more air into the combustion chamber.

Idheinz, you're talking nonsense.
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forresj
Champion Author Wilmington

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Message Posted: Jul 7, 2013 8:01:21 AM

How can anyone accurately measure 1 or 2 mpg improvement when driving behavior is realistically so erratic.
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Houckster
Champion Author Atlanta

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Message Posted: Jul 6, 2013 11:58:31 PM

10270 writes: I haven't seen a huge difference in MPG (maybe 1-2 MPG)
_____
If you got 1-2 MPG by using a K&N filter, that IS huge! The OEMs are making lots of changes like switching to electric power steering just to gain a fraction of an MPG. If such a change could not 1-2 MPG, it would be front page news.
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nurdco
Champion Author Colorado Springs

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Message Posted: Jul 5, 2013 4:23:05 PM

Cleanability for ReUse... cost effective
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102670
Rookie Author Sacramento

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Message Posted: Jul 5, 2013 1:43:10 PM

I use them. I haven't seen a huge difference in MPG (maybe 1-2 MPG). I basically buy them and re-use them.
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Thumper52
Champion Author New Brunswick

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Message Posted: Jul 5, 2013 5:48:05 AM

No
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FrankLee1
All-Star Author Minnesota

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Message Posted: Jul 4, 2013 6:34:37 PM

Good! Please find all my posts then post them up for all to see.
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ldheinz
Champion Author Chicago

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Message Posted: Jul 4, 2013 4:31:59 PM

ldheinz - "BTW, FrankLee1, I'm still waiting for your explanation of how an air filter can know whether a car is fuel injected or carbureted. "

FrankLee1, on Jun 18, 2013 5:04:05 AM - "ldheinz = wrong except maybe for carb'd cars, and how many of those are still on the road?"

FrankLee1 - "You are going to have to keep waiting because I never said that. Hold your breath, please. "

LIAR! Though I note that you waited until your earlier statement got pushed off the first page of history before you started denying that you ever said what you said. Guess what? Earlier pages are available.
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DanFMA
Champion Author Massachusetts

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Message Posted: Jul 4, 2013 12:16:40 PM

No.
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GAJDHI
Champion Author Montreal

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Message Posted: Jul 4, 2013 6:01:01 AM

no
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FrankLee1
All-Star Author Minnesota

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Message Posted: Jul 4, 2013 1:02:44 AM

You are going to have to keep waiting because I never said that. Hold your breath, please.
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ldheinz
Champion Author Chicago

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Message Posted: Jul 3, 2013 5:44:28 PM

It takes more than just stating your opinion, FrankLee1 and forresj. Debate includes supporting what you say.

BTW, FrankLee1, I'm still waiting for your explanation of how an air filter can know whether a car is fuel injected or carbureted. Fuel injection is a better way to go, but it only affects things downstream of the addition of fuel.
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FrankLee1
All-Star Author Minnesota

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Message Posted: Jul 3, 2013 5:04:57 PM

ldheinz = wrong. still wrong.
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ldheinz
Champion Author Chicago

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Message Posted: Jul 3, 2013 2:48:57 PM

gougedQC - "other tests have shown KN lets in more dust etc which is harmful to engines. increase wear..ie worst at filtering in comparison tests.."

I accidentally ran the "grease test" that was mentioned here a while back. The last time I cleaned the intake system, some gummy grime was left in the air box after the filter. I checked recently and it was sticky, but was completely without dust after 10,000 miles or so. As for wear, my car currently has 282,000 miles, and it's running fine. It's had a K&N air filter for most of that.

forresj - "Unbeleivable... "

What, your spelling? ;-)
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forresj
Champion Author Wilmington

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Message Posted: Jul 3, 2013 1:27:27 PM

Unbeleivable...
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ldheinz
Champion Author Chicago

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Message Posted: Jul 3, 2013 9:45:30 AM

rte3tdi, you are correct. If the air flows into the engine more easily and the carburetor or fuel injection therefore adds more fuel, you add more air AND fuel, and therefore you get more power and the car speeds up. The operator then lessens the gas pedal to maintain a constant speed, and the butterfly in the throttle body is closed a bit further to lower the speed. This means that the car runs at the same speed at a lower (more closed) throttle setting, and you get the same power from less air/fuel, for better gas mileage.
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rte3tdi
Champion Author New Hampshire

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Message Posted: Jul 3, 2013 6:37:32 AM

"they let more air in, but the computer automatically adjust and meter fuel and injection rates so there is no fuel or power advantage..."

Hmm... I don't understand this.

More air in -> the computer automatically adjusts and injects more fuel (to prevent the engine from running lean).

More air + fuel in -> equivalent of stepping on the accelerator.

What am I missing? Do you have a link (or reference) to the source of that scientific study?
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kmapjr
Champion Author Detroit

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Message Posted: Jul 2, 2013 7:16:36 PM

gougedQC : All top Motocross, Supercross Bike racers use them in the dirty tracks they race around on, Baja Race in Ca. where K&N Sponsors a couple trucks that have won the Baja Race, most don't even finish & I would say if any dirt could get by it would be in those situations, which are both very harsh & dusty, if there was a better technology than oil filters, I'm sure they would be all over it, but no, every dusty race I've seen, the mechanics use oiled filters. And I'm sure a Mechanic on a pro team doesn't want to be held accountable for blown engines, not a good résumé for next job. And to that is why I disagree with your findings of debris getting by.
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dontuknowOH
Champion Author Ohio

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Message Posted: Jun 30, 2013 8:37:51 AM

I often see the K&N, rather some form of that system on at least 3-5 rods at the local Cruise-ins most are plumbed in as a custom fashion for neatness and reducing space requirements.
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gougedQC
Champion Author Montreal

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Message Posted: Jun 30, 2013 8:17:29 AM

well, i wont dispute people's personal impressions (placebo effect anyone) but several scientific tests have shown zero improvement in standard family vehicles using KN...

they let more air in, but the computer automatically adjust and meter fuel and injection rates so there is no fuel or power advantage..at least according to scientific tests with really expensive equipment and dynos.

other tests have shown KN lets in more dust etc which is harmful to engines. increase wear..ie worst at filtering in comparison tests..

oil filters is a technology that goes back to pre WWII...why would you use 80 year technology on your new computerized and injected modern vehicle?

use what you want, but I would never ever use KN on regular daily vehicles.

[Edited by: gougedQC at 6/30/2013 8:19:27 AM EST]
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duybn
Champion Author Connecticut

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Message Posted: Jun 28, 2013 11:35:58 PM

Not only do they perform better, but the fact you can wash them and reuse it is a nice feature, saving you money in the long run. I have two for my vehicle one is use the other waiting the swap etc.
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Houckster
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Message Posted: Jun 26, 2013 11:42:10 AM

CHAZZER writes: I have a K & N Airfilter in my 2005 Dodge Magnum RT and ony noticed 2% increase in the gas milage. From 24 MPG to 24.04 MPG on average. $50.00 for almost nothing!
_____
Not necessarily, remember, you can clean a K&N filter while you have to replace a conventional filter.
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ldheinz
Champion Author Chicago

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Message Posted: Jun 26, 2013 11:37:58 AM

You missed a decimal point, Chazzer. A 2% improvement is 24.5, not 24.04. That should pay for the filter over time.

And yes, Houckster, personal insults are forbidden by GB policy. Let's discuss the topic, not insult people who disagree with us.
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Houckster
Champion Author Atlanta

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Message Posted: Jun 26, 2013 11:07:39 AM

The degree of performance difference between a K&N filter and a good paper filter is a LOT less than the degree of antagonism this discussion has generated. We're here to exchange ideas, not beat people over the head with our viewpoint.
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Chazzer
Champion Author Nevada

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Message Posted: Jun 25, 2013 3:02:53 PM

I have a K & N Airfilter in my 2005 Dodge Magnum RT and ony noticed 2% increase in the gas milage. From 24 MPG to 24.04 MPG on average. $50.00
for almost nothing!
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ldheinz
Champion Author Chicago

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Message Posted: Jun 25, 2013 2:59:15 PM

Likewise, I'm sure, forresj.
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forresj
Champion Author Wilmington

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Message Posted: Jun 25, 2013 2:28:56 PM

Idheinz, you're reaching for the edge. Do us a favor and jump.
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contiki
Champion Author Ontario

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Message Posted: Jun 25, 2013 11:39:36 AM

No.......
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ldheinz
Champion Author Chicago

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Message Posted: Jun 25, 2013 11:05:26 AM

Another thing to consider is deterioration of the paper element in long term usage. Paper's OK in normal use, but in very moist conditions paper can deteriorate and fail. It can not only tear and let unfiltered air through, but also be sucked into the engine. This is rare, of course, only happening if the car is stored for a long time in moist conditions.

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outlaw329
Champion Author Austin

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Message Posted: Jun 25, 2013 2:12:33 AM

In every vehicle I own. Would not be without one.
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Sipusa
All-Star Author Sacramento

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Message Posted: Jun 23, 2013 11:17:00 AM

No. I don't think it is worth the price difference unless I do have a performance car.
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phatbak
Champion Author Georgia

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Message Posted: Jun 23, 2013 8:18:13 AM

Yes!
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LostStarMD
Rookie Author Baltimore

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Message Posted: Jun 23, 2013 7:09:23 AM

I have not used the K&N brand but another similar one. I didn't really notice and MPG gain but I already have an oversized intake manifold and higher flow injectors on my Jeep Cherokee. But it sounded cooler sucking the air in. :)
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ldheinz
Champion Author Chicago

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Message Posted: Jun 22, 2013 5:10:26 PM

What would that be?
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